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Old 02-24-2021, 11:26 AM   #31 (permalink)
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heck, I'll take the optimistic position and say maybe 10 years into the future somewhere someone will make a full swappable electric motor package that just bolts in
I would hope the existing powertrains last longer than 10 years. We currently have 2 of the Ford based FFVs from 2000 with about 140,000 miles on them, our only 2 out of 70 mail trucks with 4wd in Missoula MT. So they are 20 years old and still running their original motors, transmissions, transfercases, and axles. They are built better than the older Chevy based LLVs which granted are 1994 models but I bet we don't have a single one on it's original engine and definitely not one on it's original transmission. I bet some are on their 4th or 5th transmission and 3rd engine.

To electrify our local fleet would require a whole new building. Probably a new location. Right now trucks are all outside, completely uncovered in Montana winter weather scattered here and there with a 10 bay semi loading dock in the middle trying not to take them out (which happens too often). Can you even charge a dead Li-ion battery that's been sitting outside 40 degrees below freezing all night?

Getting a new facility in the deal would be very cool but you see how it would take taxpayer funding and the Post Office would lose it's claim of self supporting. Then also FedEx and UPS will get to complain the taxpayers are unfairly subsidizing competitive parcel delivery pricing not to mention all the small businesses getting destroyed by Amazon. Amazon would be the biggest benefactor to taxpayer subsidized parcel delivery pricing.

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Old 02-24-2021, 04:02 PM   #32 (permalink)
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I’m wondering how this practical this EV requirement is going to be for federal vehicles stationed in rural western states and Alaska where they have long distances to travel, often in very cold temperatures.
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Old 02-25-2021, 01:12 AM   #33 (permalink)
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Oh I'm sure 4-5 years from now they'll make a hundred of them EV for some show pony status somewhere. The 100,000+ will be standard 3.7 duratec Ford V6. The Oshkosh was the only pure gasoline prototype to make the final. The 2nd was pure EV and the 3rd a hybrid.
I'm curious what engine Ford decided to use. The US spec Transit starts with the 3.7L but they also have 4 cylinder version in other countries.


Picking Oshkosh / Ford wasn't a surprise to me once AM General dropped out. Workhorse was never going to get it. They are a company with 100 employees, perpetually on the verge of bankruptcy, that knows nothing about mass production. Likewise I couldn't see the foreign bidders getting it (Mahindra or Karsan). That just left Oshkosh / Ford.

BTW, the Transit based van you pictured was rejected. The winning bidder looks like:

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Old 02-25-2021, 09:55 PM   #34 (permalink)
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Iím wondering how this practical this EV requirement is going to be for federal vehicles stationed in rural western states and Alaska where they have long distances to travel, often in very cold temperatures.
Even if temperatures were not so extreme, the long distances would already be troublesome. That's why I would consider hybrids a viable approach, while EVs remain too specialized to operate within a more predictable environment with a more accurate route planning.
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Old 02-26-2021, 09:47 AM   #35 (permalink)
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The Feds published a modified statement saying the vehicles will be provided with a fuel option in cold climate locations
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Old 02-26-2021, 11:54 AM   #36 (permalink)
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After 4 years I would be really surprised if 5% of government vehicles are electric. The way the government works it will take 4 years just to start getting the first charging stations installed.
The ideal application for electronic seems like it would be mail vans. But we know how the post office is, they will still be driving those new contract mail vans around in 2040.
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Old 02-26-2021, 05:09 PM   #37 (permalink)
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The Feds published a modified statement saying the vehicles will be provided with a fuel option in cold climate locations
While an EV might serve reasonably for some bureaucratic jobs, within some predictable routes, it's still worth to consider the fuel option not only for cold climate but also for emergency and military services.
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Old 02-26-2021, 07:17 PM   #38 (permalink)
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There are some applications that EVs just won't work for-at least now. The agency I worked for required high clearance all wheel drive vehicles with 200+ mile range. Infrastructure for recharging far apart. Plus will the .gov be willing to pay for employees waiting around for the charge when fueling up with petroleum takes maybe 20 minutes including comfort trip for the driver and maybe a snack. Would turn a lot of 10-12 hour day trips in to overnight with lodging and per-diem costs.

Great idea but not quite ready for prime time to say the entire fleet.
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Old 02-26-2021, 08:29 PM   #39 (permalink)
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Old 02-26-2021, 08:58 PM   #40 (permalink)
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There are some applications that EVs just won't work for-at least now. The agency I worked for required high clearance all wheel drive vehicles with 200+ mile range. Infrastructure for recharging far apart. Plus will the .gov be willing to pay for employees waiting around for the charge when fueling up with petroleum takes maybe 20 minutes including comfort trip for the driver and maybe a snack. Would turn a lot of 10-12 hour day trips in to overnight with lodging and per-diem costs.

Great idea but not quite ready for prime time to say the entire fleet.
Most federal vehicles are in a motor pool. You sign one out of a central location. Having them on a charger there would be fine and with modern ones you'd have a couple hundred miles range.

Everyone here is ridiculously focused on the long tail, but the VAST majority of federal vehicles would do just great as EVs. Around my work, they'd just need a good van option.

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