Go Back   EcoModder Forum > EcoModding > Fossil Fuel Free
Register Now
 Register Now
 

Reply  Post New Thread
 
Submit Tools LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 10-02-2019, 04:44 PM   #1 (permalink)
Administrator
 
Daox's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Germantown, WI
Posts: 11,135

CM400E - '81 Honda CM400E
90 day: 51.49 mpg (US)

Daox's Grey Prius - '04 Toyota Prius
Team Toyota
90 day: 49.53 mpg (US)

Daox's Insight - '00 Honda Insight
90 day: 64.33 mpg (US)

Swarthy - '14 Mitsubishi Mirage DE
Mitsubishi
90 day: 56.69 mpg (US)
Thanks: 2,444
Thanked 2,494 Times in 1,506 Posts
First US gas station to ditch oil for 100% EV charging opens in Maryland



An interesting article about the first gas station to stop selling gas and go entirely to EV charging. Not sure what the business model is there, but I hope it works for them. It does say there are more than 20,700 EVs registered in Maryland.

https://www.cnbc.com/2019/09/26/firs...-now-open.html

Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	106150512-1569506099831gasstation.jpg
Views:	251
Size:	59.1 KB
ID:	26922  
__________________
Current project: A better alternator delete
  Reply With Quote
The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to Daox For This Useful Post:
aerohead (11-02-2019), Flakbadger (03-07-2020), Xist (01-29-2020)
Alt Today
Popular topics

Other popular topics in this forum...

   
Old 10-02-2019, 05:14 PM   #2 (permalink)
EV convert
 
oil pan 4's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: NewMexico (USA)
Posts: 8,976

Sub - '84 Chevy Diesel Suburban C10
SUV
90 day: 19.5 mpg (US)

camaro - '85 Chevy Camaro Z28

Riot - '03 Kia Rio POS
Team Hyundai
90 day: 30.21 mpg (US)

Bug - '01 VW Beetle GLSturbo
90 day: 26.43 mpg (US)

Sub2500 - '86 GMC Suburban C2500
90 day: 11.95 mpg (US)

Snow flake - '11 Nissan Leaf SL
SUV
90 day: 141.63 mpg (US)
Thanks: 215
Thanked 2,938 Times in 2,290 Posts
Hopefully it works out I know where I am there is 0 public charging.
__________________
1984 chevy suburban, custom made 6.5L diesel turbocharged with a Garrett T76 and Holset HE351VE, 22:1 compression 13psi of intercooled boost.
1989 firebird mostly stock. Aside from the 6-speed manual trans, corvette gen 5 front brakes, 1LE drive shaft, 4th Gen disc brake fbody rear end.
2011 leaf SL, white, portable 240v CHAdeMO, trailer hitch, new batt as of 2014.
  Reply With Quote
Old 10-02-2019, 06:03 PM   #3 (permalink)
EcoModding Newb
 
redpoint5's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Oregon
Posts: 8,389

Acura TSX - '06 Acura TSX
90 day: 29.14 mpg (US)

Lafawnda - '01 Honda CBR600 F4i
90 day: 47.32 mpg (US)

Big Yeller - '98 Dodge Ram 2500 base
90 day: 21.82 mpg (US)

Prius Plug-in - '12 Toyota Prius Plug-in
90 day: 57.64 mpg (US)

Mazda CX-5 - '17 Mazda CX-5 Touring
90 day: 28.5 mpg (US)
Thanks: 2,829
Thanked 3,227 Times in 2,405 Posts
I've commented on this extensively at the Bolt forum.

Here's some of my comments:

Pricing is for their one L2 charging spot at $1.25/session + $0.08/min, which is steep. I don't see pricing info for the DCFC options.

Did anyone read the article? The guy got a nearly $800,000 grant to install 4 DCFC spots. If he'd have paid out of pocket for that, how much charging would need to occur to recoup the $200k per charger?

The whole thing is a gimmick catered to a select "elite" group of people...

I'm sure the motivation by some ws to provide a service to the public. That isn't the problem. Good intentions can still be stupid and corrupt. In fact, most bad outcomes started from good intentions.

The entities that covered the grant were not using money that was donated to them, but money extracted unwillingly from the public. And it went to a private business, an individual. I wouldn't care if the 4 chargers cost a billion dollars from someone that voluntarily donated the money. Instead the public overpaid for something that cannot exist on its own economically to cater to a very small percentage of relatively wealthy people who happen to own EVs.

The taxis wouldn't be "hogging" the charging spots if the price were set appropriately. Then we'd say they were paying for a service. As I understand, at least one of the existing spots is free, which just invites moochers.

Perhaps the area needed more chargers, and I'm happy to see charging infrastructure expand, but not at the public expense, not at the benefit of 1 private business, and not to cater to a very small/specific demographic that tends to be more well off than others. That fits the description of anti-progressive...
__________________
Gas and Electric Vehicle Cost of Ownership Calculator







Give me absolute safety, or give me death!
  Reply With Quote
The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to redpoint5 For This Useful Post:
Flakbadger (03-07-2020), MeteorGray (10-03-2019), mpg_numbers_guy (10-02-2019)
Old 10-02-2019, 09:27 PM   #4 (permalink)
EV convert
 
oil pan 4's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: NewMexico (USA)
Posts: 8,976

Sub - '84 Chevy Diesel Suburban C10
SUV
90 day: 19.5 mpg (US)

camaro - '85 Chevy Camaro Z28

Riot - '03 Kia Rio POS
Team Hyundai
90 day: 30.21 mpg (US)

Bug - '01 VW Beetle GLSturbo
90 day: 26.43 mpg (US)

Sub2500 - '86 GMC Suburban C2500
90 day: 11.95 mpg (US)

Snow flake - '11 Nissan Leaf SL
SUV
90 day: 141.63 mpg (US)
Thanks: 215
Thanked 2,938 Times in 2,290 Posts
Yeah free charging does invite moochers.

I didn't know the charge stations cost $200,000, that's ridiculous. The article I read didn't say anything about there only being 4 charge stations.
__________________
1984 chevy suburban, custom made 6.5L diesel turbocharged with a Garrett T76 and Holset HE351VE, 22:1 compression 13psi of intercooled boost.
1989 firebird mostly stock. Aside from the 6-speed manual trans, corvette gen 5 front brakes, 1LE drive shaft, 4th Gen disc brake fbody rear end.
2011 leaf SL, white, portable 240v CHAdeMO, trailer hitch, new batt as of 2014.
  Reply With Quote
Old 10-05-2019, 01:35 AM   #5 (permalink)
It's all about Diesel
 
cRiPpLe_rOoStEr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Porto Alegre, Rio Grande do Sul, Brazil
Posts: 8,424
Thanks: 0
Thanked 916 Times in 811 Posts
I have only seen EV chargers placed in "convenient" places such as mall parking lots, and some gas stations having at least one charger but none entirely replacing the fuel dispensers.
  Reply With Quote
Old 10-26-2019, 12:14 PM   #6 (permalink)
EV convert
 
oil pan 4's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: NewMexico (USA)
Posts: 8,976

Sub - '84 Chevy Diesel Suburban C10
SUV
90 day: 19.5 mpg (US)

camaro - '85 Chevy Camaro Z28

Riot - '03 Kia Rio POS
Team Hyundai
90 day: 30.21 mpg (US)

Bug - '01 VW Beetle GLSturbo
90 day: 26.43 mpg (US)

Sub2500 - '86 GMC Suburban C2500
90 day: 11.95 mpg (US)

Snow flake - '11 Nissan Leaf SL
SUV
90 day: 141.63 mpg (US)
Thanks: 215
Thanked 2,938 Times in 2,290 Posts
I just don't want to pay shipping from or drive all the way to MD to buy a going out of business chademo for dirt cheap.
__________________
1984 chevy suburban, custom made 6.5L diesel turbocharged with a Garrett T76 and Holset HE351VE, 22:1 compression 13psi of intercooled boost.
1989 firebird mostly stock. Aside from the 6-speed manual trans, corvette gen 5 front brakes, 1LE drive shaft, 4th Gen disc brake fbody rear end.
2011 leaf SL, white, portable 240v CHAdeMO, trailer hitch, new batt as of 2014.
  Reply With Quote
Old 10-26-2019, 04:22 PM   #7 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
nemo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: US
Posts: 966

Chief - '06 Pontiac Grand Prix
90 day: 25.8 mpg (US)

SF1 - '12 Ford Fiesta S
90 day: 21.28 mpg (US)
Thanks: 186
Thanked 218 Times in 172 Posts
This is no big deal! He probably wasn't making much off the gas. Inside sale and repair was always were the money was at. Don't see it as a good model for future charge locations. Better is parking garages and shopping or dinning locations were the person will be doing some thing other than just waiting. Could be incorporate with a valet business so the car could be moved as soon as it is charged opening the charger for the next vehicle.
__________________

  Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to nemo For This Useful Post:
Xist (02-03-2020)
Old 10-27-2019, 08:55 PM   #8 (permalink)
It's all about Diesel
 
cRiPpLe_rOoStEr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Porto Alegre, Rio Grande do Sul, Brazil
Posts: 8,424
Thanks: 0
Thanked 916 Times in 811 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by nemo View Post
Don't see it as a good model for future charge locations. Better is parking garages and shopping or dinning locations were the person will be doing some thing other than just waiting.
Even though some of the charge locations I see are at a gas station, they're usually right in front of the AMPM, so the driver may spend some time getting some munchies or a coffee
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-29-2020, 10:52 AM   #9 (permalink)
EV convert
 
oil pan 4's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: NewMexico (USA)
Posts: 8,976

Sub - '84 Chevy Diesel Suburban C10
SUV
90 day: 19.5 mpg (US)

camaro - '85 Chevy Camaro Z28

Riot - '03 Kia Rio POS
Team Hyundai
90 day: 30.21 mpg (US)

Bug - '01 VW Beetle GLSturbo
90 day: 26.43 mpg (US)

Sub2500 - '86 GMC Suburban C2500
90 day: 11.95 mpg (US)

Snow flake - '11 Nissan Leaf SL
SUV
90 day: 141.63 mpg (US)
Thanks: 215
Thanked 2,938 Times in 2,290 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by redpoint5 View Post
There is a an article about a private petrol station owner whose business was failing because he wasn't making money at his location selling petrol. He took his 17 year old daughter's suggestion to apply for VW money to retrofit the station to DCFC. At a cost of $800,000 all donated funds, the petrol infrastructure was removed and 4 charging stalls built. Utilization is 4-5 cars per day at an average revenue of $5 per charge... so using $800k of someone else's money has allowed them to generate $25 of gross income per day. That doesn't even cover the monthly demand charge for supplying 250 kW capability.

Privately owned charging infrastructure has several huge obstacles to overcome, most notably that they are huge money losers. Fortunately we won't need so many chargers since most people will charge from home most of the time, but there will be a problem with inadequate infrastructure during high travel times. Hopefully smart apps that take into account real time utilization will ease the problem of long charging queues.
Seems like the appropriate place.
__________________
1984 chevy suburban, custom made 6.5L diesel turbocharged with a Garrett T76 and Holset HE351VE, 22:1 compression 13psi of intercooled boost.
1989 firebird mostly stock. Aside from the 6-speed manual trans, corvette gen 5 front brakes, 1LE drive shaft, 4th Gen disc brake fbody rear end.
2011 leaf SL, white, portable 240v CHAdeMO, trailer hitch, new batt as of 2014.
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-29-2020, 12:45 PM   #10 (permalink)
EcoModding Newb
 
redpoint5's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Oregon
Posts: 8,389

Acura TSX - '06 Acura TSX
90 day: 29.14 mpg (US)

Lafawnda - '01 Honda CBR600 F4i
90 day: 47.32 mpg (US)

Big Yeller - '98 Dodge Ram 2500 base
90 day: 21.82 mpg (US)

Prius Plug-in - '12 Toyota Prius Plug-in
90 day: 57.64 mpg (US)

Mazda CX-5 - '17 Mazda CX-5 Touring
90 day: 28.5 mpg (US)
Thanks: 2,829
Thanked 3,227 Times in 2,405 Posts
Here's the follow up to that story:

https://www.yahoo.com/news/maryland-...170300709.html

I get the feeling these articles are written as if what is going on is a good thing, when the facts disclosed suggest otherwise.

Here's my comments from another forum where somehow, some people reading the same article with the same facts as I, came to the conclusion that this is a big win for EV adoption:

...I'm critical of how this was accomplished because I want to see EV charging grow in a way that makes economic (lasting) sense. It sounds like the only smart business decision this guy (or was it his economic genius 17 year old daughter) has made was to accept a continuation of loosing money on his business, but this time on someone else's tab.

Instead of VW punitive money being wasted on private owner charging stations, which will do zero to accelerate the EV transition, they could have done anything else with it. I like the idea of transitioning school buses to EV since those are the perfect use case. These buses travel relatively little distance and have ample opportunity to charge when not in use. They have huge maintenance costs which could be reduced by the less complex and higher reliability of electric systems. They burn diesel and pollute around children. I'd rather see VW money spent on a project like that, then converting a petrol station that was going under anyhow, into a soon-to-fail EV charging point. Once the charging station goes under, it will be exhibit C for the anti-EV crowd to point to as evidence that EVs suck. It will be a net setback to the cause of EVs as a result.

__________________
Gas and Electric Vehicle Cost of Ownership Calculator







Give me absolute safety, or give me death!
  Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to redpoint5 For This Useful Post:
Daschicken (01-29-2020), ldjessee00 (02-04-2020)
Reply  Post New Thread


Thread Tools




Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.5.2
All content copyright EcoModder.com