Go Back   EcoModder Forum > EcoModding > Hypermiling / EcoDriver's Ed
Register Now
 Register Now
 

Reply  Post New Thread
 
Submit Tools LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 12-13-2009, 07:10 PM   #11 (permalink)
Pishtaco
 
SentraSE-R's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Bay Area, California
Posts: 1,485

Mean Green Toaster Machine - '06 Scion xB
Team Toyota
90 day: 48.92 mpg (US)
Thanks: 56
Thanked 285 Times in 181 Posts
Like many of the others, I find bleeding off speed while climbing shorter hills is best. I've gotten 37 mpg with my SE-R on a 3 mile drive with a cold engine, by climbing a hill the first mile, and coasting the next two miles.

On long hills, there's no way around slogging it all the way, in the highest gear that will maintain speed. I typically get only 15-25 mpg climbing those hills, but FASing down them usually brings my mileage back to normal.

__________________
Darrell

Boycotting Exxon since 1989, BP since 2010
Have you ever noticed that anybody driving slower than you is an idiot, and anyone going faster than you is a maniac? George Carlin
Mean Green Toaster Machine
49.5 mpg avg over 53,000 miles. 176% of '08 EPA
Best flat drive 94.5 mpg for 10.1 mi
Longest tank 1033 km (642 mi) on 10.56 gal = 60.8 mpg
  Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to SentraSE-R For This Useful Post:
Arragonis (12-14-2009)
Alt Today
Popular topics

Other popular topics in this forum...

   
Old 12-15-2009, 09:43 AM   #12 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
The Atomic Ass's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Mason, OH
Posts: 528

Priinochio - '17 Toyota Prius Two Eco
90 day: 63.12 mpg (US)
Thanks: 11
Thanked 12 Times in 12 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Old Mechanic View Post
A modern Diesel or Gas engine can not really suffer from "Lugging" in the classical sense, because the fuel delivery is precise, regardless of the load.
In order to lug a modern engine you would have to go very low in the RPM range, down below 1100, give or take, depending on the engine being a performance type or an economy type.
I have never heard lugging as being ascribed to carburetors, I've been told that lugging is the detonation you get under high load at low RPM, which for a 4-cyl can be as high as 1,500, and in the case of my Ninja, 2,500.
__________________
  Reply With Quote
Old 12-15-2009, 03:13 PM   #13 (permalink)
EcoModding Wanabe
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Wake Forest, NC
Posts: 10

Red Rocket - '08 Toyota Yaris
Thanks: 0
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
I forgot to add one technique I use. There is one small hill, maybe 50’ to 75’ elevation right after a narrow 2 lane bridge on a back road. After the initial steep part it slowly gains elevation for about 0.4 of a mile. I have found that powering up the initial steep section to gain speed to 50 mph (psl 45 mph) will net me greater overall mileage (read: less of a loss) than gliding to the base and DWL up the entire section at 45 mph. I’m assuming it has to do with my engine BSFC chart and finding the right rpm/mph combination for the climb. Unfortunately this is the only section of my commute that I have found this technique works on.

Bottom line, try different ways of approaching hills and see if there is a combination of rpm/mph/gear that works best.
  Reply With Quote
Old 12-15-2009, 04:03 PM   #14 (permalink)
The PRC.
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Elsewhere.
Posts: 5,304
Thanks: 285
Thanked 535 Times in 384 Posts
OK, you got me. Whats a "engine BSFC chart" when its at home ?
__________________
[I]So long and thanks for all the fish.[/I]
  Reply With Quote
Old 12-15-2009, 04:48 PM   #15 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 5,927
Thanks: 877
Thanked 2,019 Times in 1,302 Posts
BSFC stands for Brake Specific Fuel Consumption.

Its a graph of the best areas of power and RPM based on the most horsepower for the least fuel consumed per HP.

regaards
Mech
  Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to user removed For This Useful Post:
Arragonis (12-15-2009)
Old 12-15-2009, 05:08 PM   #16 (permalink)
dcb
needs more cowbell
 
dcb's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location:
Posts: 5,038

pimp mobile - '81 suzuki gs 250 t
90 day: 96.29 mpg (US)

schnitzel - '01 Volkswagen Golf TDI
90 day: 53.56 mpg (US)
Thanks: 158
Thanked 267 Times in 210 Posts
Not sure about the OP diesel, but hills in mine should be gone up at 1750 rpm and full throttle in the highest gear that will get me closest to that, followed by an unobstructed glide on the backend of course But that is where I make the most power for a given amount of fuel on my tdi. Start gliding prior to the peak so that you glide crawl over the top and reduce need for braking as appropriate.
from ecomodders very own wiki (which anyone can edit/contribute to) Brake Specific Fuel Consumption (BSFC) Maps - EcoModder
__________________
WINDMILLS DO NOT WORK THAT WAY!!!

Last edited by dcb; 12-15-2009 at 05:15 PM..
  Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to dcb For This Useful Post:
Arragonis (12-15-2009)
Old 12-15-2009, 05:12 PM   #17 (permalink)
The PRC.
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Elsewhere.
Posts: 5,304
Thanks: 285
Thanked 535 Times in 384 Posts
Is there a temple where one may make offerings or incantations to obtain said chart ?

Or indeed a website ?


EDIT : Ahh, I see.
__________________
[I]So long and thanks for all the fish.[/I]
  Reply With Quote
Old 12-15-2009, 05:19 PM   #18 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 5,927
Thanks: 877
Thanked 2,019 Times in 1,302 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Atomic Ass View Post
I have never heard lugging as being ascribed to carburetors, I've been told that lugging is the detonation you get under high load at low RPM, which for a 4-cyl can be as high as 1,500, and in the case of my Ninja, 2,500.
The carburetor in your Nnja (correct me if I am wrong) is very similar to the original SU types used in Britain dating back to the mid century.

They are a variable venturi type without accelerator pumps. A single tapered needle and seat with a ported vacuum operated diaphragm (either rubber or metal) raises the needle and changes the volume of fuel in relation to throttle opening and engine speed.

Without any accelerator pump you do not have the issue of a specific volume of fuel being introduced into the engine regardless of the engine's speed.

In the classic term, the way I learned it in the 1960S, lugging an engine meant you were engaging the accelerator pump at too low RPM. The amount of fuel entering the engine was far too much for the volume of air. This made the mixture so rich, most of the fuel was not mixed properly for combustion.

Lugging a Ninja would certainly occur at higher RPM, when you consider the redline of the 250 CC engine, which (again if memory serves me right) is in the 12-14k RPM range. Some Bike engines are even higher.

Now I would not consider that a typical passenger car engine, especially if we are discussing a diesel, many of which would never operate at RPM ranges much higher than 2500. At 12k, I am not aware of any diesel that would not have disintegrated long before that RPM level was reached.

My VX shift indicator lights up to recommend an up shift at 1000 Rpm in 5th gear. That's a very low RPM level for 5th gear operation, but in the VX the engine is designed for that low speed torque.

To the original poster;

When I recommend drafting in heavy traffic, it is always in the right lane. The Interstates here have very heavy traffic volumes. One section here has 49,000 cars pass over the same spot, in the same lane, every day.

When you divide 84,600 seconds per day by 49,000 vehicles, you have less than 2 seconds of average separation per vehicle 24-7. Understand that during the 10PM to 6 AM hours the traffic volume is much lower on average, the separation time during heavies flow is less than 2 seconds per car, probably less than 1.5 seconds. At 55 MPH PSL, that amounts to an average separation distance of about 110 feet minus the vehicle length average of 15 feet. 95 feet separation distance average for 18 hours a day, including tractor trailers and other large vehicles.

My drafting distance is the same as my stopping distance in those conditions. Even then, you will have people cut in front of you and pass on the right, the vehicle in the left lane. Some separation distances and so ridiculously low, I can read the month and year on the license plate stickers in my rear view mirror, and my eyes are not that good any more.

If you leave more distance between you and the vehicle in front of you and the vehicle behind you is inches from your rear end (as you previously stated), is the danger not greater than if the distances were more close to the same?

The last 5 plus times I have been involved in any collision, I was hit in the rear, so that is where the danger is greatest, at least for me in my particular circumstances.

Driving for 44 years.

regards
Mech
  Reply With Quote
Old 12-15-2009, 05:23 PM   #19 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 5,927
Thanks: 877
Thanked 2,019 Times in 1,302 Posts
Traffic Cameras | HamptonRoads.com | PilotOnline.com

Check out the bridge tunnel section at normal rush hours for bumper to bumper traffic.

regards
Mech
  Reply With Quote
Old 12-15-2009, 05:25 PM   #20 (permalink)
dcb
needs more cowbell
 
dcb's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location:
Posts: 5,038

pimp mobile - '81 suzuki gs 250 t
90 day: 96.29 mpg (US)

schnitzel - '01 Volkswagen Golf TDI
90 day: 53.56 mpg (US)
Thanks: 158
Thanked 267 Times in 210 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Arragonis View Post
Is there a temple where one may make offerings or incantations to obtain said chart ?

Or indeed a website ?


EDIT : Ahh, I see.
LOL, did my post make any sense?

__________________
WINDMILLS DO NOT WORK THAT WAY!!!
  Reply With Quote
Reply  Post New Thread


Thread Tools


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Effect of gear oil viscosity on transmission efficiency (Metro owners take note) MetroMPG EcoModding Central 44 12-09-2014 12:22 AM
New CVT transmission electric-assist with electric assist Ptero Fossil Fuel Free 2 09-23-2010 11:41 PM
Tesla Roadster's 98% efficient transmission nominated for innovation award MetroMPG Fossil Fuel Free 20 12-20-2009 02:51 PM
Synthetic transmission fluid for a manual transmission? abcdpeterson General Efficiency Discussion 15 10-12-2009 09:56 AM
Choosing a Manual Transmission Fluid for my Mazda Protege 1337 EcoModding Central 5 03-20-2009 01:07 PM



Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.5.2
All content copyright EcoModder.com