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Old 06-29-2009, 07:54 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Honda wussed out

The initial pics/concept of the new Insight had some low profile mirrors that were looking very aero, but they went for the traditional crappy mirrors on the production models.

I don't know why everyone resists change and advancement so much...wouldn't the mirrors have cost about the same to manufacture, no matter what design they used?

I know they alread have the tooling for the status quo, but why not actually push forward a bit? It seems like honda and toyota have actually crippled their conventional models the past couple years, in order to make the hybrids look like a better deal/have further seperation.

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Old 06-29-2009, 09:36 PM   #2 (permalink)
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I'm just mad they didn't put rear wheel skirts on it. It's a step backwards from the one 10 years ago. How much sense does that make?
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Old 06-29-2009, 10:20 PM   #3 (permalink)
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And no manual transmission! Where's the fahrvergnuegen in a CVT?

But the bottom line on the new Insight, for me, is that the fuel economy is unimpressive. The first generation Insight made numerous, drastic sacrifices to gain a few MPG, and was therefore a commercial failure. Lots of us here have expressed our disappointment that the new Insight did not take the same approach.
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Old 06-29-2009, 10:24 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RobertSmalls View Post
The first generation Insight made numerous, drastic sacrifices to gain a few MPG, and was therefore a commercial failure. Lots of us here have expressed our disappointment that the new Insight did not take the same approach.
To become another commercial failure?
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Old 06-29-2009, 10:45 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dutchboy View Post
The initial pics/concept of the new Insight had some low profile mirrors that were looking very aero, but they went for the traditional crappy mirrors on the production models.

I don't know why everyone resists change and advancement so much...wouldn't the mirrors have cost about the same to manufacture, no matter what design they used?

I know they alread have the tooling for the status quo, but why not actually push forward a bit? It seems like honda and toyota have actually crippled their conventional models the past couple years, in order to make the hybrids look like a better deal/have further seperation.
I am sure they consider them a safety issue. They were hard to see out of. They wont keep the rear view cameras on the CR-Z concept either. Such is the nature of concept cars.
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Old 06-29-2009, 10:46 PM   #6 (permalink)
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It's kinda sad when a Fit can match the Insight's EPA highway fuel economy. The Fit in question was also loaded to the gills, driving 70 mph from SC to NY.

They could have gotten a few more MPG out of the Insight. And also not crippled the Fit's EPA fuel economy to make the Insight more attractive. I guess 29 mpg combined (real-world with psycho drivers is 4-5 mpg higher, and hypermilers can get ~40 or greater) was the point that their focus groups told them they would pony up $3k more for a car that got ~41 combined.
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Old 06-30-2009, 01:50 PM   #7 (permalink)
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A step backwards? IMHO, it's about a half-marathon run backwards.

The original Insight didn't (as far as I can tell, and I've owned one for six years) make any sacrifices, drastic or otherwise. In fact, it made a lot of... brain stall here - what's a word that's the opposite of sacrifice? ...design decisions that made it quite costly to build.

Nor was it a failure in any sense. It was an experiment: Honda built the car as a real-world test of hybrid technology, and sold it for less than what it cost to build. They chose to build limited numbers, and sold all that they built. How's that a failure?

As for the mirrors, I really wish they'd change the regulations, and allow rear-view cameras instead. Not just for aerodynamics, but as a safety issue. I'm effing tired of being blinded by the glare from following cars whose drivers apparently never heard of low beams.

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Old 06-30-2009, 02:04 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Don't really have anything new to add. My thoughts reflect those of others in the thread. However, i shall watch with rapt attention..

a.k.a. Subscribed.
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Old 06-30-2009, 03:17 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Honda has to deal with a little something called 'REALITY'. You might have heard of it. Its the place where the DOT regulates the size of rear view mirrors, cost dictates the diameter of your rims etc. If you want all that concept car junk on your car, you're welcome to get your hands dirty and build those parts yourself. I'm sure the aftermarket would be more than happy to sell it to you as well. The new insight is a huge leap forward from the first generation simply because a lot more people will buy it. Toyota and Honda tried completely different formulas with the first generation hybrids. The 4 door practical sedan/hatch back won because real people with real money to spend are willing to sacrifice some fuel economy in exchange for a practical family car. Honda got the message and followed the leader. More power to them. At least they have the ability to adapt and learn from their mistakes. More than I can say for GM.

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Old 06-30-2009, 04:08 PM   #10 (permalink)
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I am suprised that they don't make the wheel skirts as an option you can buy. If they could quantify the fe increase the additional parts they may actually sell some.

On a side note, I saw that Red Line Oil is making fluids for modern CVT's including Hondas.

Don

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