Go Back   EcoModder Forum > EcoModding > EcoModding Central
Register Now
 Register Now
 

Reply  Post New Thread
 
Submit Tools LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 07-29-2008, 01:48 PM   #11 (permalink)
Sinusoidal Amulite
 
geoff's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 11

Escort Service - '95 Ford Escort LX Hatch
90 day: 32.28 mpg (US)
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Send a message via AIM to geoff
Just having the car lower shouldnt really affect the aerodynamics, any fuel savings would come from the fact that things like spliters are closer to the ground. I would tell you not to waste your time with it if you are that concerned over only doing it to break even after 70 tanks of fuel.

If you are interested :

1) Find out what springs are avalible for your car, make sure they match what you want. Some springs may lower the car too much, or too little for what you want. You also want to check the spring rate of the new springs, to stiff will be uncomfortable for a daily driver and can shake things loose on bad roads (over time). Others may be too soft and the car can/will bottom out over big dips or with more weight in the car. The cost of a quality set of lowering springs, for a street car, will range in price from about $150-250 average. Be aware that some cheap springs will be made of cheaper materials that can break or sag over time, or they might not be well suited for the application you are using. Since springs play a major roll in the cars ability to turn, accelerate and brake...PLEASE DONT CUT CORNERS AND TRY TO SAVE $$$ IN THE NAME OF SAFETY. If a spring was to break at highway speeds, it could very easily cause a serious crash.

2) If your not going to install them yourself, add in the cost of an install. If your just having new springs put in (keeping stock shocks and stuff) figure 2hrs of labor for a shop with the right tools, if you are having it done at the same time as something else (brakes, shock change, ect) it could save you some money since some of the disassembly will already be done for the other job.

3) I would HIGHLY recomend you replace/upgrade your shocks at the time you change the springs. Stock vehicle shocks (most of the time) are valved only for the stock spring rate and ride height. Lowering the car and/or having a stiffer spring rate (almost all lowering springs are stiffer) will cause the shock to opperate outside of its normal range. This will cause the shock to have a much shorter life span or fail outright. Bad shocks will cause the car to bounce over bumps and hurt the ride quality and handling. If your shocks have more than about 50k miles on them, chances are they are already not working as well as they should. If you replace the springs and also replace the shocks with new OEM units, it will be ok for a while, but the shocks will wear out again, and faster than with the stock springs...if you find a good shock to match to the new springs you the ride quality will be better, and the life of the shock will be longer than OEM shocks with aftermarket springs.

4) You might be able to get away without messing up the allignment too bad, but chances are you will end up with a car that is out of spec when the work is done. To get the most out of the new suspension parts, youll need to have the allignment re-set. If you want to take on the challenge, you can allign the car yourself and get pretty close to the right specs for camber and toe using the "string-box" method. Caster is a little harder to set this way, but caster shouldnt change much anyway. A bad allignment will speed up tire wear, can cause a drop in MPG and make the cars handling dangerous (something like too much toe out in the rear).

Sure you could find cheap/used lowering springs and have a buddy install them for around $100, but to do it RIGHT and get the most benefit from lowering the car...I would plan on spending $200 (springs) + $450 (shocks) + $100 (allignment) + 2hrs of labor (if your having a shop do the work).

__________________
  Reply With Quote
Alt Today
Popular topics

Other popular topics in this forum...

   
Old 07-29-2008, 01:58 PM   #12 (permalink)
Batman Junior
 
MetroMPG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: 1000 Islands, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 21,710

Blackfly - '98 Geo Metro
Team Metro
Last 3: 70.09 mpg (US)

MPGiata - '90 Mazda Miata
90 day: 53.56 mpg (US)

Winter beater Metro - '00 Chevrolet Metro
90 day: 61.98 mpg (US)

Fancy Metro - '14 Mitsubishi Mirage top spec
90 day: 58.72 mpg (US)

Even Fancier Metro - '14 Mitsubishi Mirage top spec
90 day: 66.29 mpg (US)
Thanks: 3,442
Thanked 6,264 Times in 3,238 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by geoff View Post
Just having the car lower shouldnt really affect the aerodynamics
Lowering affects aero, regardless of the presense of splitters/dams.

It can reduce frontal area slightly, improve the fineness ratio (height/length), and improve Cd. Manufacturers do lower some vehicles specifically to improve aero.

See this thread: http://ecomodder.com/forum/showthrea...drag-1783.html

Of course whether or not it will benefit a specific vehicle depends on that vehicle's starting point.
__________________
Latest mods: 3-cylinder Mitsubishi Mirage. EcoMods now in progress...
Ecodriving test:
Manual vs. automatic transmission MPG showdown



EcoModder
has launched a forum for the efficient new Mitsubishi Mirage
www.MetroMPG.com - fuel efficiency info for Geo Metro owners
www.ForkenSwift.com - electric car conversion on a beer budget
  Reply With Quote
Old 07-29-2008, 02:36 PM   #13 (permalink)
Hypermiler
 
PaleMelanesian's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Texas
Posts: 2,313

PaleCivic (retired) - '96 Honda Civic DX Sedan
90 day: 69.2 mpg (US)

PaleFit - '09 Honda Fit Sport
Team Honda
Wagons
90 day: 44.06 mpg (US)
Thanks: 605
Thanked 422 Times in 277 Posts
It also depends on the kind of driving. If all the driving is stop-and-go city stuff, it won't make a bit of difference. If it's all interstate driving, it could make a big difference.
__________________



11-mile commute: 100 mpg - - - Tank: 90.2 mpg / 1191 miles
  Reply With Quote
Old 07-29-2008, 03:36 PM   #14 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Earth
Posts: 5,209
Thanks: 225
Thanked 808 Times in 592 Posts
In my case, it would probably give me worse mpg, averaged over a year. The Insight's pretty low already, and if there's more than about 4-5" of snow on the roads, it becomes a very ineffective snowplow - which really kills fuel economy :-)

OTOH, I really wish I could figure some way to lower my Toyota pickup about 6", just to make loading it easier. Any mpg gain would be a bonus.
  Reply With Quote
Old 07-29-2008, 04:12 PM   #15 (permalink)
Pokémoderator
 
cfg83's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Southern California
Posts: 5,864

1999 Saturn SW2 - '99 Saturn SW2 Wagon
Team Saturn
90 day: 40.49 mpg (US)
Thanks: 439
Thanked 528 Times in 355 Posts
Hello -

Which Lexus "auto lowers" at freeway speeds? How much does it lower and what are the claimed MPG gains?

CarloSW2
__________________

What's your EPA MPG? Go Here and find out!
American Solar Energy Society
  Reply With Quote
Old 07-29-2008, 04:23 PM   #16 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
aerohead's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Sanger,Texas,U.S.A.
Posts: 11,665
Thanks: 18,755
Thanked 6,072 Times in 3,717 Posts
numbers

Quote:
Originally Posted by IvanAndreevich View Post
Nevertheless, he has a valid question. Does anyone have any numbers before/after lowering?
I've never seen a specific breakdown.The really high mpg/low drag concept cars are lowered with active suspension,so they can still negotiate driveway ramps and such.They tell you what the Cd is with the "drop",however do not provide Cd for "street' configuration.If you want to slide your car under Darin's teardrop template,you could probably calculate the difference in virtual wake area,with and without the drop.Any 10% reduction in wake area would yield a 10% drag reduction,and 5-6% better mpg,at 55-70 mph,respectively, do to fineness-ratio alteration from drop.Search for" permanent Metro Kammback" to find Darin's template.
__________________
Photobucket album: http://s1271.photobucket.com/albums/jj622/aerohead2/
  Reply With Quote
Old 07-29-2008, 04:25 PM   #17 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
aerohead's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Sanger,Texas,U.S.A.
Posts: 11,665
Thanks: 18,755
Thanked 6,072 Times in 3,717 Posts
Big Dave,those are useful numbers and I'm writing them down.Thanks mucho!!!!!!!!!
__________________
Photobucket album: http://s1271.photobucket.com/albums/jj622/aerohead2/
  Reply With Quote
Old 07-29-2008, 05:07 PM   #18 (permalink)
Batman Junior
 
MetroMPG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: 1000 Islands, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 21,710

Blackfly - '98 Geo Metro
Team Metro
Last 3: 70.09 mpg (US)

MPGiata - '90 Mazda Miata
90 day: 53.56 mpg (US)

Winter beater Metro - '00 Chevrolet Metro
90 day: 61.98 mpg (US)

Fancy Metro - '14 Mitsubishi Mirage top spec
90 day: 58.72 mpg (US)

Even Fancier Metro - '14 Mitsubishi Mirage top spec
90 day: 66.29 mpg (US)
Thanks: 3,442
Thanked 6,264 Times in 3,238 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by cfg83 View Post
Hello -

Which Lexus "auto lowers" at freeway speeds? How much does it lower and what are the claimed MPG gains?

CarloSW2
I believe I read about a Cd difference of .01 for the active suspension (which lowers the car 1 inch at freeway speeds) vs. the regular car. Sorry I don't have a link handy. I think it was the '06 LS460 (Cd .26)
__________________
Latest mods: 3-cylinder Mitsubishi Mirage. EcoMods now in progress...
Ecodriving test:
Manual vs. automatic transmission MPG showdown



EcoModder
has launched a forum for the efficient new Mitsubishi Mirage
www.MetroMPG.com - fuel efficiency info for Geo Metro owners
www.ForkenSwift.com - electric car conversion on a beer budget
  Reply With Quote
Old 07-29-2008, 11:07 PM   #19 (permalink)
EcoModding Apprentice
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Brunswick, Ohio
Posts: 121

Danger Ranger - '01 Ford Ranger Edge 4x4
90 day: 14.52 mpg (US)

Moms car - '05 Ford Freestyle Limited
90 day: 21.92 mpg (US)

Mistress - '10 Harley-Davidson 883 Sportster 883 Iron
90 day: 42.53 mpg (US)
Thanks: 0
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Send a message via AIM to meemooer
well... if you lift a truck the FE goes down, if you lower it, most guys get better FE.
So wouldn't it be the same way with a car?
__________________
Randy
  Reply With Quote
Old 09-04-2008, 06:46 PM   #20 (permalink)
METROANNOSAURUS REX
 
FunkSkunk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Marble, NC
Posts: 121

The Mach .05 - '98 Chevy Metro LSi
90 day: 48.88 mpg (US)
Thanks: 0
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Found a good price on a real set of springs here --> Intrax 25-1-010 - Intrax Lowering Springs - summitracing.com

HTH

__________________

  Reply With Quote
Reply  Post New Thread


Thread Tools


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Car and Driver magazine ecomods a Pinto: MPG up +25% MetroMPG EcoModding Central 34 01-29-2014 07:00 PM
Smart Car MPG in the City Arminius General Efficiency Discussion 22 03-26-2011 07:00 PM
Active grill block idea holypaulie Aerodynamics 17 10-13-2008 09:31 AM
$500 and 30mpg car? possible? olderthanme EcoModding Central 6 07-15-2008 09:37 PM
Family car with good MPG? rykoala Off-Topic Tech 20 06-28-2008 11:22 PM



Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.5.2
All content copyright EcoModder.com