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Old 08-20-2008, 02:47 PM   #171 (permalink)
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Allow me to parse:

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Originally Posted by aerohead View Post
........

When I contacted the tire maker,who manufactured the concept tire,and asked if it would be going into production,and would be available in the aftermarket,they thanked me for my interest and explained that the tire design belonged to the carmaker,and they would have the answers I seeked.------------------------ Upon writing to the carmaker,complementing them on their accomplishment,and what a benefit such a technology would be to so many aspects of the American economy and environment,I inquired as to whether they would consider a licensing agreement to allow tire makers to manufacture the LRR tires.The tires offered a 17% improvement in MPG.........
I think you missed interpreted what both the tire manufacturer and the vehicle manufacturer were trying to tell you - and it appears you missed what I was trying to tell you as well.

Tire manufacturers do not set the specs, but they are the ones with the technology - and the vehicle manufacturers are the ones who set the specs, but they do not possess the technology.

So the vehicle manufacturer COULDN'T license the technology back to the tire manufacturers - they didn't have it.

I remember when that concept car came out. All us tire engineers said "B***S**T!!! They did something that was not going to work in production.

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Originally Posted by aerohead View Post
........

Would you hold out any hope that we might see the commercial exploitation of such tire technology within our lifetimes? It seems like the time is right for such things,more so than at any other time. Please comment if you can.Thanks!
No. As the phrase goes - This is not Rocket Science. The tire manufacturers know how to decrease the RR by half - but the compromises needed to make that happen are not acceptable to the buying public.

All you have to do to confirm this is go to Tire Rack and look at all the complaints about wear and traction on OE tires. Gauging from the volume of complaints, the vehicle manufacturers apparently have pushed the envelope too far.

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Old 08-20-2008, 03:40 PM   #172 (permalink)
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Thanks CapriRacer! Just another dead end in my long list of dead ends! Looks like LRR was the only attribute of the concept tires,and given the myriad demands placed on a passenger car tire,they were not deemed worthy for the market.'guess that's why I try and stick to aero.I don't need a patent licensing agreement to make friends with the atmosphere.At least I have that.Again thanks much!!!!!!!!!!! Now I'm going to beat my head against a concrete wall.Sure would have loved to have a set of those fancy rubber donuts.
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Old 08-20-2008, 08:25 PM   #173 (permalink)
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Exclamation Piiiissssshhhhhhhhhhhh

I've been following this thread with much interest since it started. I also bumped up the tires on the protege to sidewall max, 44psi. All was well for a while...

I got married on the 8th, so made 4 120mile-round-trips to the airport that week. Well, 80+ empty and late twice, 80+ full and late twice, and always 65 and drafting on the way back. It was always 90F or above here in FLA.

The day of the wedding my now wife heard a weird noise, sounded almost like a siren. Maybe like airpressure through a valve stem?...

Gas mileage went way down (filled up on monday and WTF???). So today i checked and pressure was 0psi according to my awsome chrome $3 guage.

Filled it back to 37, it was at 35 an hour later... I haven't found any punctures, but based on the weird noise report, i'd say this wasn't your everyday roofing nail or whatnot.

My gut says the valve stem couldn't hold a full car at 95F and my wife driving
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Old 08-21-2008, 06:53 AM   #174 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sickpuppy318 View Post
I've been following this thread with much interest since it started. I also bumped up the tires on the protege to sidewall max, 44psi. All was well for a while...

I got married on the 8th, so made 4 120mile-round-trips to the airport that week. Well, 80+ empty and late twice, 80+ full and late twice, and always 65 and drafting on the way back. It was always 90F or above here in FLA.

The day of the wedding my now wife heard a weird noise, sounded almost like a siren. Maybe like airpressure through a valve stem?...

Gas mileage went way down (filled up on monday and WTF???). So today i checked and pressure was 0psi according to my awsome chrome $3 guage.

Filled it back to 37, it was at 35 an hour later... I haven't found any punctures, but based on the weird noise report, i'd say this wasn't your everyday roofing nail or whatnot.

My gut says the valve stem couldn't hold a full car at 95F and my wife driving

Any time there is significant air loss in a tire, there has to be a cause. The fact that the tire is now holding air doesn't mean the problem has gone away. Check the tire for bulges by rubbing your hand over the entire tread surface (I'd recommend using gloves).

If you don't find anything, monitor the pressure and the tire's tread surface (by rubbing) over the next few weeks.

If you do find something, replace the tire IMMEDIATELY!! Once it is off the vehicle, look for cuts in the vicinity of the bulge. A cut in the belt will weaken the tire's structure and a separation will grow off the cut.

Keep us updated. I'm sure all of us are interested on reports of probelms using higher pressures.

BTW, did the gauge register ZERO pressure? It may be time to replace the gauge.
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Old 08-21-2008, 09:17 AM   #175 (permalink)
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Did those tires come from Discount Tire? There's a recall on the valve stems they used over the last 1.5 -2 years. Definitely inspect them and maybe get them replaced.
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Old 08-21-2008, 08:43 PM   #176 (permalink)
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Never run a tire that has been "run flat" since the sidewall becomes weak especially if you find rubber powder inside the tire.
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Old 08-21-2008, 09:01 PM   #177 (permalink)
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it was definatly "run flat". i noticed the drop in milage first, but i doubt its been completely flat for a week.... i hope! Actually, thinking about it for a while, that tire is probably the one that had a puncture about six months ago. I'm not positive though.

I got it from tire kingdom. And they don't do plugs anymore, probably for good reason. So my wife had it pluged by some local shop on her way home. that was some time ago...

I still havn't found anything in the tire, but it is "hurricane-ing" out so i didn't look long. I think that plug might have gave out??? Down to 15psi after 24 hours.

i doubt its been completly flat for a week.....
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Old 08-21-2008, 09:13 PM   #178 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CapriRacer View Post
BTW, did the gauge register ZERO pressure? It may be time to replace the gauge.
HoLY Crap i just realized something. its a stick type guage, ambiant pressure pushes back on the stick, right?

So if a flat tire reads zero (stick doesn't move), then a reading of 44psi is really 44psi above abmiet pressue??? Would a $3 gauge compensate in any way???

If not, then i've had my tires at 58.7psi! That's hyperinflation baby!
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Old 08-22-2008, 05:05 AM   #179 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sickpuppy318 View Post
it was definatly "run flat". i noticed the drop in milage first, but i doubt its been completely flat for a week.... i hope! Actually, thinking about it for a while, that tire is probably the one that had a puncture about six months ago. I'm not positive though.

I got it from tire kingdom. And they don't do plugs anymore, probably for good reason. So my wife had it pluged by some local shop on her way home. that was some time ago...

I still havn't found anything in the tire, but it is "hurricane-ing" out so i didn't look long. I think that plug might have gave out??? Down to 15psi after 24 hours.

i doubt its been completly flat for a week.....
1) ALL pressures we normally deal with are GAUGE pressures. The only time you have to deal with ABSOLUTE pressures is if you are dealing with weather and barometers - and of course, if you are using the PV=nRT formula. If you don't know what the formula is about, then you don't need to worry about it.

2) If the tire has a plug in it, then you shouldn't be inflating the tire over the placard value. Plugs are temporary repairs have have an annoying habit of leaking. Maybe not 100% of the time, and maybe not NOW, but often enough that they are unreliable for anything other than a temporary fix. So get the tire properly repaired - NOW. (which brings me to point #3)

3) If the tire had ZERO pressure, then it was run flat. That causes the tire's sidewall to weaken. making it more suspectible to a sudden blowout - and if that happens at high speed - well, the results could be tragic. So while the tire is being properly repaired, have the repair guy look inside. If there is any evidence of rubber dust or flaking, or there is abrasion on the outside sidewall, the tire is toast! Get it replaced. Do this NOW. Your life is worth more than the inconvenience.
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Old 08-22-2008, 07:17 AM   #180 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sickpuppy318 View Post
HoLY Crap i just realized something. its a stick type guage, ambiant pressure pushes back on the stick, right?
A spring retracts the stick. Ambient atmospheric pressure could not do the job since that pressure exists on both sides of the plunger when the gage is on the shelf. The only way to counter that would be to put a perfect vacuum acting against one wide of it and that would last a matter of seconds or minutes at best on a $3 gage.

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