Go Back   EcoModder Forum > EcoModding > EcoModding Central
Register Now
 Register Now
 

View Poll Results: Would you use a flammable refrigerant?
I'd consider it 18 81.82%
No way! 4 18.18%
Voters: 22. You may not vote on this poll

Reply  Post New Thread
 
Submit Tools LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 06-05-2019, 04:34 PM   #61 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
teoman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2017
Location: Istanbul
Posts: 1,245

A3 - '12 Audi A3
Thanks: 65
Thanked 225 Times in 186 Posts
It already cycles on and off.

  Reply With Quote
Alt Today
Popular topics

Other popular topics in this forum...

   
Old 06-05-2019, 04:39 PM   #62 (permalink)
Human Environmentalist
 
redpoint5's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Oregon
Posts: 12,396

Acura TSX - '06 Acura TSX
90 day: 24.19 mpg (US)

Lafawnda - '01 Honda CBR600 F4i
90 day: 47.32 mpg (US)

Big Yeller - '98 Dodge Ram 2500 base
90 day: 21.82 mpg (US)

Prius Plug-in - '12 Toyota Prius Plug-in
90 day: 57.64 mpg (US)

Mazda CX-5 - '17 Mazda CX-5 Touring
90 day: 26.68 mpg (US)

Chevy ZR-2 - '03 Chevrolet S10 ZR2
90 day: 17.14 mpg (US)
Thanks: 4,192
Thanked 4,380 Times in 3,354 Posts
I've heard it said before that R12 was a more efficient refrigerant than R134a, but was eliminated due to the ozone depleting CFCs. As far as I was able to research, efficiency is measured as COP (coefficient of performance), and R134a has a higher COP (better).

Anyone know which is more efficient? If R134a is more efficient, why was R12 ever used in the first place?
__________________
Gas and Electric Vehicle Cost of Ownership Calculator







Give me absolute safety, or give me death!
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-06-2019, 10:31 AM   #63 (permalink)
Somewhat crazed
 
Piotrsko's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: 1826 miles WSW of Normal
Posts: 4,043
Thanks: 462
Thanked 1,104 Times in 974 Posts
Because it was cheaper to use and install, used a "normal" lube oil not a synthetic and worked well enough. 134 and its variants were designed after the ozone hole.
__________________
casual notes from the underground:There are some "experts" out there that in reality don't have a clue as to what they are doing.
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-06-2019, 11:07 AM   #64 (permalink)
Thalmaturge
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: The edge of nowhere
Posts: 1,156

The Tinyvan - '07 Honda Fit Sport

Spicy Italian - '13 Fiat 500 Abarth

eBike - '94 Trek Mountain Track 820
Thanks: 763
Thanked 637 Times in 424 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by redpoint5 View Post
I've heard it said before that R12 was a more efficient refrigerant than R134a, but was eliminated due to the ozone depleting CFCs. As far as I was able to research, efficiency is measured as COP (coefficient of performance), and R134a has a higher COP (better).

Anyone know which is more efficient? If R134a is more efficient, why was R12 ever used in the first place?
R12 works with simple mineral oil. IIRC R134a requires synthetic POE oil (which can replace mineral oil in R12 systems, too)... so I'd guess it was a problem of first practically usable discovery.
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-06-2019, 12:03 PM   #65 (permalink)
Corporate imperialist
 
oil pan 4's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: NewMexico (USA)
Posts: 11,175

Sub - '84 Chevy Diesel Suburban C10
SUV
90 day: 19.5 mpg (US)

camaro - '85 Chevy Camaro Z28

Riot - '03 Kia Rio POS
Team Hyundai
90 day: 30.21 mpg (US)

Bug - '01 VW Beetle GLSturbo
90 day: 26.43 mpg (US)

Sub2500 - '86 GMC Suburban C2500
90 day: 11.95 mpg (US)

Snow flake - '11 Nissan Leaf SL
SUV
90 day: 141.63 mpg (US)
Thanks: 269
Thanked 3,522 Times in 2,796 Posts
The hole in the ozone is still there and bigger than ever.
It's more than likely always been there.
__________________
1984 chevy suburban, custom made 6.5L diesel turbocharged with a Garrett T76 and Holset HE351VE, 22:1 compression 13psi of intercooled boost.
1989 firebird mostly stock. Aside from the 6-speed manual trans, corvette gen 5 front brakes, 1LE drive shaft, 4th Gen disc brake fbody rear end.
2011 leaf SL, white, portable 240v CHAdeMO, trailer hitch, new batt as of 2014.
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-06-2019, 12:41 PM   #66 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
teoman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2017
Location: Istanbul
Posts: 1,245

A3 - '12 Audi A3
Thanks: 65
Thanked 225 Times in 186 Posts
I have ordered some cheapo misting nozzles. I will install them on the front bumper spraying on the condenser and maybe the compressor head to give the AC system a boost in efficiency.

I have also been logging the intake temperature of my TDI. Usually the intake temperature is a few degrees C higher than ambient temperature. When the AC is switched on, the temp goes up 10-15 degs C above ambient.

Hot air is not good for the diesel either, I am hoping this misting will be able to cool things down without consuming a tonne of water.

Something that resembles this:
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-06-2019, 12:43 PM   #67 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
teoman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2017
Location: Istanbul
Posts: 1,245

A3 - '12 Audi A3
Thanks: 65
Thanked 225 Times in 186 Posts
Come to think of it, if it was a gasoline car, making a hot air intake over it would be a good idea.
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-06-2019, 01:09 PM   #68 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
teoman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2017
Location: Istanbul
Posts: 1,245

A3 - '12 Audi A3
Thanks: 65
Thanked 225 Times in 186 Posts
Video of the results:

https://youtu.be/O0MY0diHo4U
  Reply With Quote
Old 07-01-2019, 04:48 PM   #69 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
teoman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2017
Location: Istanbul
Posts: 1,245

A3 - '12 Audi A3
Thanks: 65
Thanked 225 Times in 186 Posts
https://newatlas.com/mistbox-air-con...ecooler/38139/

That is a commercial system that increases the efficiency of A/C systems by using evaporative cooling by means of water misting the intake air.


Here is an educated discussion on the matter:
https://hvac-talk.com/vbb/showthread...condenser-unit


The main concearn is rusting the coils and getting mineral deposits.

The key point seems to be having the spray as far away from the condenser as possible.

Shouldn’t automotive systems be more resilient ot road grime and debris gathering on the condenser.
  Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to teoman For This Useful Post:
EcoCivic (07-01-2019)
Old 07-01-2019, 06:15 PM   #70 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
Join Date: Jul 2017
Location: Memphis, Tn
Posts: 463
Thanks: 320
Thanked 107 Times in 81 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by teoman View Post
https://newatlas.com/mistbox-air-con...ecooler/38139/

That is a commercial system that increases the efficiency of A/C systems by using evaporative cooling by means of water misting the intake air.


Here is an educated discussion on the matter:
https://hvac-talk.com/vbb/showthread...condenser-unit


The main concearn is rusting the coils and getting mineral deposits.

The key point seems to be having the spray as far away from the condenser as possible.

Shouldn’t automotive systems be more resilient ot road grime and debris gathering on the condenser.
I tried a homemade version of that on my car's AC using a pump up sprayer and some hose. I didn't check the pressures or temperatures (I will retest that soon and report back), but the AC did seem to perform a little better when idling in traffic. That is until I ran out of water.

I didn't use it for long enough to damage the condenser, but it might have if I used it for longer. A car's AC condenser is (to the best of my knowledge) no less susceptible to mineral buildup than a house AC unit's condenser. This problem could be eliminated by using distilled water, but that would get expensive if you have to buy the water.

However, you could use the condensate from your home AC system as a source of free distilled water. I installed a mini split in my living room but I have been too lazy to run a drain line, so it's draining into a trash can. I use that water for radiator water, in my water cooled computer, and to wash the car.

  Reply With Quote
Reply  Post New Thread


Thread Tools




Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.5.2
All content copyright EcoModder.com