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Old 08-11-2020, 04:51 AM   #1 (permalink)
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Mercedes 300 DE - the last diesel hybrid?

The diesel-hybrid car: a great concept that car manufacturers have never really got into, apart from a few study models or very temporary versions that were not renewed. And yet Mercedes still does believe in the concept with his new C & E-class 300 DE. With an average consumption of 138 to 168 MPG, it seems to be the best of two worlds. The last of its kind, or a revival of the diesel engine?



Some specs:
combined power & torque: 306 hp & 516 lb-ft
Very streamlined with a Cd of 0.24
9-speed transmission capable of 1400 rpm @ 75 mph

Shame that it's not affordable for the common man ... Seems to me the ideal taxi/cab!
What do you think about this?

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Old 08-11-2020, 10:27 AM   #2 (permalink)
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Those stated MPG claims are always a little wooly, what is its steady state consumption at speed? I bet it isn't 136 MPG then.

That said, it seems to me that the diesel engine is a natural match for onboard range extension duties.
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Old 08-11-2020, 05:40 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Didn't someone swap a diesel into a 1st gen insight?

Found it:
https://www.autoblog.com/2009/09/05/...grade-gets-80/
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Old 08-11-2020, 06:51 PM   #4 (permalink)
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I hope it may persuade regulators to resume some common-sense and quit the witch-hunting which had been harder on Diesels for a while. On a sidenote, I do believe an overwhelming majority of new cars will feature some sort of hybrid capability in short to mid term.
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Old 08-12-2020, 12:24 AM   #5 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cRiPpLe_rOoStEr View Post
I hope it may persuade regulators to resume some common-sense and quit the witch-hunting which had been harder on Diesels for a while. On a sidenote, I do believe an overwhelming majority of new cars will feature some sort of hybrid capability in short to mid term.
There is no diesel witch hunt - they just aren't getting special treatment anymore.

For years diesels were allowed to pollute more. With Euro 6 emissions gasoline and diesel cars are almost treated the same. Diesels are allowed a little more NOx and gas cars are allowed a little more CO. PM and PN are the same so DI gas cars get to have particulate filters too.
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Old 08-12-2020, 12:37 AM   #6 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by elhigh View Post
Those stated MPG claims are always a little wooly, what is its steady state consumption at speed? I bet it isn't 136 MPG then.

That said, it seems to me that the diesel engine is a natural match for onboard range extension duties.
I'm sure that 138 MPG is the equivalent to our MPGe and helped out by a big UK gallon.

In this review they averaged 63 MPG over 7500 miles:

https://www.fleetnews.co.uk/cars/rev...rm-test-review
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Old 08-12-2020, 11:22 AM   #7 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by elhigh View Post
Those stated MPG claims are always a little wooly, what is its steady state consumption at speed? I bet it isn't 136 MPG then.
It's a plug-in hybrid and it has 30 miles electric range. Power consumption may not have been included.
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Old 08-12-2020, 11:29 AM   #8 (permalink)
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Quote:
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On a sidenote, I do believe an overwhelming majority of new cars will feature some sort of hybrid capability in short to mid term.
Mild hybrid systems, as they are called.
Would like to see a diesel hybrid in a normal size family car, without too many gadgets & no excessive horsepower under the hood. It really shouldn't weigh 4000 lbs.

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Yes, something like that
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Old 08-12-2020, 03:18 PM   #9 (permalink)
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diesel revival?

Quote:
Originally Posted by GreenTDI View Post
The diesel-hybrid car: a great concept that car manufacturers have never really got into, apart from a few study models or very temporary versions that were not renewed. And yet Mercedes still does believe in the concept with his new C & E-class 300 DE. With an average consumption of 138 to 168 MPG, it seems to be the best of two worlds. The last of its kind, or a revival of the diesel engine?



Some specs:
combined power & torque: 306 hp & 516 lb-ft
Very streamlined with a Cd of 0.24
9-speed transmission capable of 1400 rpm @ 75 mph

Shame that it's not affordable for the common man ... Seems to me the ideal taxi/cab!
What do you think about this?
The move by many EU member nations to forbid internal combustion engines from their city centers has precipitated a move towards plug-in hybrids, if not BEVs, which satisfy the zero-emissions mandate.
And Teutonic engineering pride has been injured by Tesla, laughed at in 2013, and in 2020, remaining without rival.
All the legacy carmakers are moving to electric vehicles. And there's not much of a business model now, to justify ICE, whether gasoline or diesel.
Hybrids have served as a bridge technology, but with accelerating BEV technology, and lowering costs, it makes more economic sense to just skip the dual technology of a hybrid, and make the leap to BEV.
In five years, BEVs are predicted to cost no more than conventional cars. Today, many consumers already pay much in excess for ICE vehicles, than for BEVs.
As to the mpg claim for the Mercedes. A diesel engine is no more thermally efficient than some Toyota Atkinson-cycle gasoline engines in their Prius cars. It's true that Diesel fuel itself has more BTU per gallon than gasoline, however it's not enough to remarkably surpass the Prius' 55-mpg combined, as reported for the 300 DE.
A Ford C-Max Energi gets 175-mpg-e at a constant 40-mph.I'd like to know the conditions at which the M-B attains 168.
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Old 08-12-2020, 05:48 PM   #10 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aerohead View Post
A Ford C-Max Energi gets 175-mpg-e at a constant 40-mph.I'd like to know the conditions at which the M-B attains 168.
On the WLTP - Worldwide Harmonized Light Vehicle Test Procedure

https://www.wltpfacts.eu/from-nedc-to-wltp-change/

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