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Old 08-26-2019, 01:03 PM   #71 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by oil pan 4 View Post
A lot of shops are charging 50 to 100 dollars per hour.
The minimum shop time for something like that will be at least 2 hours per wheel, possibly up to 3 or 4 hours per wheel.
Meanwhile the only maintenance my leaf drive system has had was tires at 60,000 an oil change at 70,000 miles, even then the oil change isn't recommended for 2011.
By 2015 and up they recommend 110,000 miles.
I agree. A technician, trained to diagnose, then repair a wide range of systems costs that much and more.

But, we arenít talking about that dude.

We are talking about bench production work. Anyone with a room temp IQ Aand a modicum if manual dexterity, can be trained to perform such a task. If you can keep him busy, his costs should be a good bit below 50/hr.

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Old 08-26-2019, 02:45 PM   #72 (permalink)
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You want the teenager overeager to use an impact wrench to replace hub motors? I would not expect them to be as fast as a technician. Four hours x $50 hourly = $200. If they manage to drive the average 15,000 miles a year, that is $200 in maintenance every sixteen months. Let's say that replaces a car with a $30 oil change every 4,000 miles.
There are many aspects to vehicle maintenance, but that trade-off is now 50% more expensive.
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Old 08-26-2019, 03:22 PM   #73 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pete c View Post
I agree. A technician, trained to diagnose, then repair a wide range of systems costs that much and more.

But, we arenít talking about that dude.

We are talking about bench production work. Anyone with a room temp IQ Aand a modicum if manual dexterity, can be trained to perform such a task. If you can keep him busy, his costs should be a good bit below 50/hr.
Then you incur shipping cost to a rebuild center.

No matter how you cut it there is no reason to go with hub motors over established motor, transaxle setups.
But anyone who loves wasting money can be my guest.

I see no advantage to hub motors at this point.
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Old 08-26-2019, 06:15 PM   #74 (permalink)
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Hah, I wouldn't want a vehicle that has maintenance requirements approaching a helicopter. At that point I just want a helicopter.

If hub motors need to be rebuilt every 20k miles, that means their MTBF is much higher, so we'd be tempted to push the service intervals.

I'd say hub motors need to solve some problem significantly better than non-hub motors for them to be reasonable solutions. What is that problem they solve significantly better? Cost? I'd pay extra to have something higher performing and more reliable.

Tesla's motor is something like $400, which seems pretty darn reasonable to me. Of course there's drivetrain components which add up, but you get the performance and reliability of a Tesla motor.
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Old 08-26-2019, 08:40 PM   #75 (permalink)
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The only thing they might kind of solve is efficiency.
But it would appear most of the efficiency gains to be had by Nissan and some of the other manufacturers is idle power draw, DC-DC converter and inverter efficiency.
Rather than the few percent that might be gained by hub motors.
Then instead of 1 inverter like you have with the leaf a hub motor car is going to have 2 or 4 motors therefore just as many inverters. So any efficiency gains realized by hub motors may very well we wiped out by duplicate or quadruplicate electronics.
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Old 08-26-2019, 11:05 PM   #76 (permalink)
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There would be efficiency in terms of space packaging. And four inverters could be smaller that the one.

But I wonder about gear reduction. Most single-speed electrics appear to have a ratio of 7 or 8:1. Do they have a planetary reduction gear?
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Old 08-27-2019, 09:17 AM   #77 (permalink)
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Planetary is just about always used in auto transmissions and transaxles.
I would be surprised if most gear reducing EV transmissions didn't use planetary.

I think I would rather have a hydrogen powered car over this vapor ware hub motor joke.
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Old 08-27-2019, 10:04 PM   #78 (permalink)
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Quote:
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Planetary is

I think I would rather have a hydrogen powered car over this vapor ware hub motor joke.
You can get a used 2016 Toyota Mirai with 30,000 miles for under $5000 out of auction.

Would need a reformer so you could fuel off cng
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Old 08-28-2019, 04:21 PM   #79 (permalink)
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I can get hydrogen from the lock welding get store for around $100 per bottle.
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Old 08-28-2019, 04:48 PM   #80 (permalink)
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hydrogen

Quote:
Originally Posted by oil pan 4 View Post
Planetary is just about always used in auto transmissions and transaxles.
I would be surprised if most gear reducing EV transmissions didn't use planetary.

I think I would rather have a hydrogen powered car over this vapor ware hub motor joke.
It's okay as long as we don't leak it.It's extremely destructive to the stratosphere.

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