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Old 12-27-2010, 05:25 AM   #1 (permalink)
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Pad Heaters - Group Buy (Europe)!

For those who haven't been following the discussion in Where to buy pad type engine block heaters?, here's the news: I'm trying to organize a group buy of pad type oil pan heaters. I e-mailed three companies, two replied, and I picked the one with better prices. Here is an e-mail from Wolverine's European division:
Quote:
your email to Wolverine Heaters has been forwarded to ourselves are we are responsible for sales in Europe.

Engine Oil Heaters.

Our Engine Oil Heaters are thin, flexible heating pads that are permanently bonded to the bottom or side of the oil sump. The heater has the special adhesive already on it, by simply peeling off the protective backing and pressing the heater firmly in place on a clean, flat surface, the heater is ready to be used. Note the heater must be installed on a smooth flat area, free of grooves and ridges. Only to be installed on metal oil sumps.

No special tools or skills are required. Except for the plug, everything for a complete installation is included with each heater.

An Engine Oil Heater is far superior to a block heater and more efficient as a block heater only "warms" a part of the engine not the complete engine.

An Engine Oil Heater "heats" all the engine starting at the bottom.

The hot oil heats the crankshaft, which in turn heats the connecting rods, pistons and cylinder heads. Remember "heat rises”.

In 2 hours, an engine oil heater can raise the engine oil temperature 40°C.

By installing an Engine Oil Heaters, your engine will start easier and there will be less engine wear and less emissions on startup.

The smallest heater we have is the 50 watt, model 4.5-120 It is only available in 120 volts so you would need a small transformer.

Our 240 volt heaters are as follows. They are supplied without an electrical plug.

The model 9.0-240 measures 7.5 cm (3.0”) diam. and is designed for engines with an oil capacity of 2-4 ltrs.

The model 9.1-240 measures 4 x 15 cm (1.5”x6”). and is designed for engines with an oil capacity of 2-4 ltrs.

The model 16-240 measures 10x11.5 cm (4”x4.5”) and is designed for engines with an oil capacity of 5-14 ltrs

The model 40-240 measures 15x18 cm (10”x11.5”) and is designed for engines with an oil capacity of14-25 ltrs

The model 80-240 measures 15x30 cm (6”x12”) and is designed for engines with an oil capacity of 25-50 ltrs.


Note: All heaters require a smooth flat surface on the side or bottom of the oil sump for installation.

Filter Heaters.

Our Filter Heaters are flexible heating pads designed to be installed on fuel, lube oil and hydraulic filters. They are easy to install and remove using Velcro straps to keep the heater in place.

There are two sizes available, both are 12 volt d.c.

FHS50. This is a 50 watt heater, draws 4 amps and is designed for filters with a diam. of 6 - 9 cm (2.5”- 3.5”)

FH100. This is a 100 watt heater, draws 8 amps and is designed for filters with a diam.of 9 -12cm (3.5”- 4.75”)

Battery Warmers.

Our Battery Warmers are of similar design as the engine oil heaters, without the adhesive. They are installed under the battery so they are very easy to install. The BH-60 is 60 watts, which will keep the battery warm and prevent overheating. The BH-60 measures 14 cm x 21.50 cm and is suitable for most vehicles and trucks. By installing a Battery Warmer, the efficiency of the battery will be increased to give you reliable starting ability on the coldest days. (Not to be installed in insulated battery boxes).

Pricing:

Model 4.5-120 Engine Oil Heater $49.00 usd
Model 9.0/9.1-240 Engine Oil Heater $55.00 usd

Model 16-240 Engine Oil Heater $65.00 usd
Model 40-240 Engine Oil Heater $90.00 usd
Model 80-240 Engine Oil Heater $120.00usd
Model FHS-50 Filter Heater $49.00 usd

Model FH-100 Filter Heater $65.00 usd

Model BH-60 Battery Warmer $30.00 usd

Shipping: Please advise the number of heaters you wish to purchase and we will advise shipping costs.

Example: To send one model 9.0-240 to Poland is $10.00
Prices are in USD.

Confirming we will offer you a discount based on the number of heaters you wish to purchase.

Delivery: Stock

Ordering:

We accept, Visa, Master Card and PayPal. (You do NOT need a PayPal account to pay by this secure method)

If you have any questions, please contact us.

Regards
David

International Diesel Group Inc.

Toronto, ON. Canada

Engine Oil Heaters - Filter Heaters - Battery Warmers. For use on diesel and petrol engines, fuel, biodiesel and hydraulic filters as well as engine starting batteries.
In another e-mail they said that
Quote:
There is no minimum for a group buy. The more heaters ordered the
larger the discount.
They also prefer to send the whole batch to one address, so this is why this group buy is for Europe - there is no need for them to send the whole batch from Canada to Europe and then send half of it back to North America. Anyone who would like to organize a group buy on the west end of the Pond can go ahead and do it, I know that a few members would be interested. I've also tried to negotiate a discount for EcoModder.com members (maybe something similar to the deal we have on ScanGauges), but they haven't responded to that yet. If and when they do, I'll let everyone know.

For now, any members from Europe interested in getting a heater from the e-mail quoted above please let me know (either post here or send me a PM) which model and how many. Once we know how many heating pads will be ordered, we'll be able to get a discount. After that the order will come to one of us (probably me, unless someone volunteers to relieve me), and that person will then ship to each member individually. There may also be a customs fee, but I've had no luck finding info on that. So the total cost of the order will be something like:
price - rebate + (shipping from Canada)/(number of pads) + customs fee (maybe) + shipping within Europe.
Shipping from Canada depends on the amount, for 1-2 pads it's $10, so it shouldn't be more than $5-$7 per pad. European shipping is less, no more than 3€-6€, I guess.

NOTICE: As mentioned in the quoted e-mail, the pad heaters do not have an electrical plug (only a cable). This is because:
  • There are at least 2-3 different plug types in Europe,
  • European plugs are hard to get in North America.
So you'll also need to add your plug, but that is simple.

NOTICE #2: Replying to an earlier question: Pad heaters cannot be uninstalled. Once they are glued on, they stay on. So if you are planning to replace you oil pan (or whatever you want to stick a pad heater to), do that first. Of course, you can order now, since it will probably be cheaper than ordering individually later.

Deadline is
January 16 2011

or 1-2 days later if need be.

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Piwoslaw's Peugeot 307sw modding thread


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Old 12-27-2010, 05:28 AM   #2 (permalink)
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I'll add that the 50W pad (which I wanted to get for my transmission) is only available for 120V So I'm getting a 125 watt 240V round pad (model 9.0-240). Jabb and vtec-e are also interested in that size, so the order size is 3 already
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Old 12-27-2010, 10:57 AM   #3 (permalink)
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Nice work getting this group buy going, Piwoslaw.

I saw one line in the vendor's description that stuck in my craw though:

Quote:
The hot oil heats the crankshaft, which in turn heats the connecting rods, pistons and cylinder heads. Remember "heat rises”.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but "heat rises" only applies to the liquids in the equation, not the solids.
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Old 12-27-2010, 11:43 AM   #4 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MetroMPG View Post
Correct me if I'm wrong, but "heat rises" only applies to the liquids in the equation, not the solids.
I believe that is more or less true. In this case, the pad's heat will rise through the oil, so it will be uniformly heated. Some heat will also be conducted through any metal that is touching the oil pan or oil. Metal conducts in any direction, but in this case it would be "up" anyway. Plus air "is also a liquid", so some (not much) will rise and transmit heat from the oil's surface to the crank and pistons.

I doubt that a pad heater will get the engine red hot, but over 4-6 hours the lower parts of it will acquire some warmth. And when it starts turning, the warm oil will wash over everything and the temperatures will even out. Having an electric oil pump would help distribute heat while the pad is still working.
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Old 01-04-2011, 04:53 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Bumping this thread.

Just 11 days until I start to order!!
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Old 01-05-2011, 05:40 AM   #6 (permalink)
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Is this heat pad alone enough to warm up engine (warm coolant so engine does not waste fuel in first minutes to warm-up) or is it for oil warming and lubrication?

How many gas-engine users are using engine heaters?

Last edited by meelis11; 01-05-2011 at 05:42 AM.. Reason: typos fixed
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Old 01-05-2011, 06:28 AM   #7 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by meelis11 View Post
Is this heat pad alone enough to warm up engine (warm coolant so engine does not waste fuel in first minutes to warm-up) or is it for oil warming and lubrication?
The engine will not get HOT, but it will be warm. Cold coolant doesn't directly effect wear, but cold oil does. (Cold coolant may effect ignition, but only in diesels.) The warm-up times will be shorter, since the oil will transfer some of its heat to the block and coolant once it starts flowing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by meelis11 View Post
How many gas-engine users are using engine heaters?
The ones I know of are Tygen1 and MetroMPG. Both use them together with a coolant heater, but a lone heating pad will also do its job, as long as it is plugged in for 4-6h, instead of the coolant heater's 1-2h.
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e·co·mod·ding: the art of turning vehicles into what they should be

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Old 01-11-2011, 09:01 AM   #8 (permalink)
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Ecoxantia found some heating pads at RS. They look OK, the pricing is close to Wolverine's, but the dimensions appear to be much larger. This should keep the oil from burning, but may be hard to find a big enough spot. For example, their 100W heater is available in either 10x15cm or 20x15cm, while Wolverine's 125W pad is 4x15cm or 7.5cm diameter round. My oil pan won't fit anything bigger than 8x12cm, so I'll have to stick (pun indended) to the 7.5cm diam model.

RS does have a 50W pad for 220VAC (item nr 245-613), but it is also 10x15cm, while my transmission's smooth metal area is 3 times smaller Can't stop thinking about it, though...

Here is a link to the 50W pad:
Selfadhesive heatermat, 50W 100x150mm

So, does anyone think we should try to negotiate with RS, or do we stick with Wolverine?

So far I've got word from vtec-e, Jabb, and Ecoxantia that they are interested, so that would be 4 pads including mine. I'm guessing that their discount will be similar to what Titan offered 5 years ago (15%). I'll e-mail them today and ask for more details.

Anyone who is interested, please measure your oil pan and tell me which model you would like. I'm getting model 9.0-240 (125W, 7.5cm diam). If anyone would also like battery or filter heaters, go ahead and say so.
I'd like to order next week.

EDIT: They confirmed that the rebate is 15%.
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e·co·mod·ding: the art of turning vehicles into what they should be

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Piwoslaw's Peugeot 307sw modding thread


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Old 01-12-2011, 03:29 PM   #9 (permalink)
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More heating pads, thanks again ecoxantia
Flexible Silicone Rubber Fibreglass Insulated Heaters
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Old 01-16-2011, 06:38 AM   #10 (permalink)
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Today's the last day!

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