Project 100 (custom enclosed Honda C90 targets 100 mph vmax and 100 km/L FE)

[jkv357]

Originally Posted by redyaris

Take a look at what shifter Karts do. they have a hand operated shifter lever. they use 125cc motorcycle engine/transmission setups and have been doing this for decades now. I wouldn't be surprised if they have tried all the methods you discribe.

I agree that you should look into the system that Shifter Karts use.

In typical kart fashion, it shouldn't be any more complicated than necessary to do the job.


Jay

[TedV]

I'm a little late to this thread, but if the brake bias is off and you need to rework the pedal to master cylinder assembly, there is a device called a brake balance bar used in racing where different master cylinders are used front and rear. The master cylinder push rods are linked to te pedal by this threaded bar. By turning the center balance bar it adjust what percent of pressure is applied to each master cylinder. There are also remote knob kits to adjust the bias while driving.

[visionary]

Well thanks for the thoughts! I think the main point that I take on board is to forget the synergy with other systems on the vehicle and go for the lightest and simplest solution.

I’m very familiar with gearbox karts, as we know them over here, and I admire the engineering of the typical rod shift system using spherical rod-end bearings. However, the distance that I need to cover, without intrusion into the driver’s space, makes for a complex arrangement. Karts have different entry and fitting criteria, so I need to find a design with that precision of selection, but a light, simple and non-intrusive operation.

So, with an eye to a “mechanical” system, I think its got to be cable operated. Using two lightweight cables (bicycle brake cables) working in opposition to one another – a pull/pull system.

The reason I considered other “powered” systems was the synergy benefits, as the parking stand will definitely require power assistance. My calculations show that it will require quite a lot of energy to deploy a parking stand correctly. The “overcenter” action will need to lift the vehicle by say 50mm, and that’s from the unloaded position. So it will need to lift at least 50% of the riders weight and approx 40kg of its own weight (but that’s a guess). This is because, unlike a traditional motorcycle, it will be practically impossible to enter or exit and still support the machine upright. Just like getting in or out of a car, the driver will rely upon the machine for stability.

[Grant-53]

The assumption is that the machine must be lifted to provide stability. Is a small amount of tilt to the curb side acceptable? See some of the systems used on streamlined recumbents. I used to be a pnuematics tech if you wanted to explore that approach.

[godscountry]

Originally Posted by visionary

Well thanks for the thoughts! I think the main point that I take on board is to forget the synergy with other systems on the vehicle and go for the lightest and simplest solution.

I’m very familiar with gearbox karts, as we know them over here, and I admire the engineering of the typical rod shift system using spherical rod-end bearings. However, the distance that I need to cover, without intrusion into the driver’s space, makes for a complex arrangement. Karts have different entry and fitting criteria, so I need to find a design with that precision of selection, but a light, simple and non-intrusive operation.

So, with an eye to a “mechanical” system, I think its got to be cable operated. Using two lightweight cables (bicycle brake cables) working in opposition to one another – a pull/pull system.

The reason I considered other “powered” systems was the synergy benefits, as the parking stand will definitely require power assistance. My calculations show that it will require quite a lot of energy to deploy a parking stand correctly. The “overcenter” action will need to lift the vehicle by say 50mm, and that’s from the unloaded position. So it will need to lift at least 50% of the riders weight and approx 40kg of its own weight (but that’s a guess). This is because, unlike a traditional motorcycle, it will be practically impossible to enter or exit and still support the machine upright. Just like getting in or out of a car, the driver will rely upon the machine for stability.

a small air tank will operate pneumatic pistons,which are cheap,many times before needing to be refilled,a simple manual override.You need to lift the vehicle,two small legs could easyily lift vehicle when parking,like F1 cars.

[godscountry]

Originally Posted by visionary

Project Overview

The principle project objective is to create a vehicle that has a maximum speed in excess of 100mph, can achieve 100mpg+ at its cruising speed of 70mph, from an engine displacement of 100cc.

EDIT
So here is a concept sketch for the project. On the basis that a picture is worth a thousand words, it should make it easier for anyone to understand what I am aiming for.


I have done enough research to believe that these targets are possible, although they will be difficult to achieve. I will hamper myself further by choosing to run exposed wheels, which is a personal choice, as I don’t like the “dustbin” fairing style. I think it is important to ensure that the vehicle remains “cool” if it’s ever to be widely accepted.

Many years ago I was inspired by Amory Lovins’ Hypercar principle, then quickly realised that one of the biggest drawbacks would be congestion, which is already a major source of waste. Since then I have worked on “single person vehicles” as a part of the solution. I have already produced a full size prototype vehicle with single track and fully enclosed bodywork, which I will call an “internal motorcycle”. This initial vehicle is a pure “proof-of-concept” prototype and has no chance of being acceptable for road-testing on the public highway. Therefore I intend to use “Project 100” as a spin-off, which allows me to complete lots of road testing, without worry about registration and the fear of arrest, much as Craig Vetter does.

I have chosen to start with a Honda C90 “cub” as a donor vehicle, due to its high production numbers, horizontal engine design and low capacity. I will fabricate a new frame that allows recumbent seating and cover it with my prototype bodywork.

I would very much welcome all comments and opinions (positive and negative) as I document the project. This forum contains many wise voices and I am a firm believer in “the wisdom of the crowd”, and how that can provide a better outcome.

you can go fairly large on engine displacement and still achieve 100 mpg,if the body is done right.You don't want to have to put your hand or foot deep into the throttle to build speed,it wastes gas.

[Quasiff]

The stand problem:

The Quasar roofed motorbike uses a double side stand (one each side) operated by a single pull rod. Simple and it works. Only drawback I see is that it leans the bike over to whichever side it's initially tilted when the handle is pulled. I think the Royce Creasey Voyager uses a long lever to operate the centre stand from a seated position. Ross Cowie in Canada did work on landing gear. Peraves Monotracer/Ecomobile has probably the most famous commercial solution.

I have designed and built many pneumatically operated machines. Pneumatics can definitely do what you want, but you need to calculate the volume and pressure to size the reservoir (and on-board compressor if needed). Compressed air powered motion is very energy inefficient, so you need to be careful how you use it.

[visionary]

Missing my deadline - first ride by beginning of April
OK, so it’s a self-imposed deadline but I’ve still missed it! The thing now is to focus on what I have left to do. To complete a “first ride” in an off-road location the bare essentials are –
Finish intake port and fit carburettor
Cut up original donor bike exhaust and extend to rear
Fit brake lines and bleed brakes (quick strip & rebuild callipers for safety)
Make throttle cable and link to foot pedal
Swap dummy motor for good one in donor bike
Mount fuel tank (temporary one will do)
Fit battery and essential electrics from donor bike
Finish intermediate shaft gear location and primary drive chain tensioner.
Fit gear selector cables and mechanism
Well, when I look at it like that I guess mid May is possible. I just have to keep reminding myself to keep it simple.

On the stand subject - my final version will almost certainly be pneumatic so I will accept any help available, but to keep my focus on a quick finish I will make a rudimentary side stand and put up with a difficult entry/exit in the meantime.

[Electictracer]

When I was working on this similar problem I was planning on using double acting cylinders with a single two position 4 way solenoid valves for positive pressure on both actions. Then, using your suggestion, a spring holding it up in case of system failure. Theses solenoid valves around 60 dollars US, making it the most expensive part of the system. I also bought a variable pressure regulator to make better use of the tanks volume and allow the force and speed to be dialed in. You probably already have thought about this stuff, but that’s my two cents. It gets complicated fast.

Brock
Oregon Commuter guy

[big shafe]

How do you plan to balance while applying some type of stand mechanism, if you are still in the vehicle? Or does it balance well enough when stationary?

I would suggest a third small wheel/caster on a hinge mechanism, offset to one side that you could fold down from the drivers seat. Hinge, caster, and shear pin. That way you could deploy while moving and not have to worry about keeping balance.