Range anxiety is overrated

[darcane]

Originally Posted by JSH

I leased my 2016 Spark EV for $100 a month. $0 down, 10K miles per years, 39 months. I could have purchased it for $10,600 but EV technology is changing so fast I went for the lease.

I can't think of a cheaper way to drive a car. My 03 Jetta TDI that I bought new and kept for 10 years cost $185 per month just for the purchase and the 05 Prius I purchased used and kept for 10 years cost $187 per month.

Maybe I'm missing something, but how the heck can you buy a Spark EV for $10,600? MSRP is about $26k. I know the Federal subsidy will knock it down some, but that's still a long ways off from the price your stating. Is there a state subsidy for EVs in Oregon on top of the Federal one??

[darcane]

Originally Posted by NeilBlanchard

One cannot have anxiety about something that you understand the limits of.

That's a funny thing to say.

If you know the limits and push them anyways, I think it's fair to saw you will have some anxiety over it.

If I know I get 300 miles per tank in my gasoline powered car but I have to go 320 miles to get to the next gas station, I'm going to be a bit concerned about it.

Same thing with an EV, except on some of them the range is a lot less. With a range of under 100 miles, this situation will be encountered more often.

Of course, when I knew I had to go long distances with no gas stations, I just grabbed a few Jerry cans and filled them up. I'm not sure how you do that on an EV... bring a generator maybe?

[LittleBlackDuck]

Originally Posted by NeilBlanchard

One cannot have anxiety about something that you understand the limits of.

What an abject load of crap sourced directly from the fount of ignorance! I suggest you start to learn some basic psychology before spouting off again.

Anxiety does not depend upon knowledge nor understanding; it is often triggered by a small amount of uncertainty whether real or not, and cannot just be turned off at will.

Simon

[gone-ot]

Somebody's *button* got pushed when it shouldn't have been touched...?

[JSH]

Originally Posted by darcane

Maybe I'm missing something, but how the heck can you buy a Spark EV for $10,600? MSRP is about $26k. I know the Federal subsidy will knock it down some, but that's still a long ways off from the price your stating. Is there a state subsidy for EVs in Oregon on top of the Federal one??

Oregon doesn't have any EV subsidies.

$25,995 MSRP
$ 7,500 Federal Tax Credit
$ 7,900 GM Rebate
$10,595 Final Price

GM is throwing a bunch of cash on the hood to clear out the Sparks before the Bolt arrives.

[LittleBlackDuck]

Originally Posted by Old Tele man

Somebody's *button* got pushed when it shouldn't have been touched...?

Nope. I am getting tired of people trivializing mental health issues, not only in this forum. I have recently had a friend trying to deal with overwhelming anxiety and depression after her partner comitted suicide because of anxiety issues that were summarily dismissed by lots of people including the medical profession.

Simon

[redpoint5]

Originally Posted by LittleBlackDuck

Nope. I am getting tired of people trivializing mental health issues, not only in this forum. I have recently had a friend trying to deal with overwhelming anxiety and depression after her partner comitted suicide because of anxiety issues that were summarily dismissed by lots of people including the medical profession.

Simon

I would say that is a big button right there. My friend's little sister hung herself in his basement 2 years ago, and the closer to Christmas it gets, the more it weighs on my mind. The world shouldn't harbor such despair.

That said, Neil wasn't talking about clinical anxiety, rather the more common discomfort one feels when going outside their comfort zone.

[Natalya]

Whether someone experiences anxiety or not as a real phenomenon does not mean that the anxiety is rational or founded in facts. The amygdala is always looking for an excuse to stress you out and scare you, that's actually its evolutionary goal -- keep you on high alert because danger could be around every corner.

In any case, consumers appear to be constantly concerned or anxious about things related to their vehicles that have absolutely no basis in reality. Here are some common unfounded concerns that I have heard from multiple people in both the USA and Canada:

1: "My car is too small, I'm going to be stuck in a situation where it isn't big enough."
- I hear this from anyone who owns a sedan. I even hear this from people driving Honda Fits and Elements. For some reason all that storage space that those cars have doesn't actually matter, the car simply isn't big enough and the owner is afraid that one day they're going to get into a pickle because the car isn't large enough.
- In reality 99% of their driving will be done with the vehicle not loaded anywhere near capacity.
- Only contractors and farm or construction workers ever need a big vehicle.
- Minivans are useful if you have children of course, but theres a difference between an Odyssey or Sienna and a Navigator.
- Everyone forgets about the convenience of a trailer or maybe renting a trailer for the one day every two years when you need to move a load of stuff.
- Everyone forgets that they know 7 other people with SUVs who they can ask for assistance that one time they have to move something.

2: "A two-seater isn't going to work because I have to carry passengers."
- No you don't need to carry passengers. Ever. Unless you have a family in which case you know a minivan might be convenient but honestly you can get by with a Fit or a Focus hatchback unless you have like 3 children. I guess then you can go for the minivan.
- Many people just commute to work and back alone, you don't need extra seats for that.
- Its easy to forget that if you do need to carpool somewhere your carpool buddy probably has a car with extra seats so its still safe to get the two-seater for commutes.
- Trailer hitches and rental trailers can help carry extra stuff if you need to.
- It is cheaper to rent a box truck for a day or two to move stuff than it is to keep a large vehicle insured the whole year.

3: "An electric vehicle isn't going to drive far enough, I will get stranded."
- If you live on your own I wouldn't recommend one. But if you have family or a partner or wife//husband then they probably have a car too. In a multi-car situation one person is almost certainly in a position where they drive less than 100 miles every day and could take the electric.
- They also forget that many hypermiling techniques can be used to extend the range of EVs.

4: "A small car is dangerous, I am going to get killed on the road."
- Many small cars have excellent crash ratings.
- Cars are safer today than ever before.
- Tiny and old G1 Insight can protect its passengers in a head-on collision at 65km/h with no permanent or debilitating injuries.

5: "Hypermiling is dangerous, driving 6 inches behind a semi will get you killed."
- Many people I have talked to got this bad impression of hypermiling that you hang out behind a semi. That's insane, you don't have to do that.
- The reality is that hypermiling is a whole pick-and-choose assortment of fuel saving techniques. You can take what you like and leave the rest. Proper tire inflation for example is a good start. Taking your foot off the accelerator if you see a red light ahead is another easy technique. Other people drive right up to the light then slam on the brakes. Taking your foot off the gas isn't dangerous like drafting a semi, and its still going to save gas.
- Drafting a semi isn't the best either because typically semi drivers really hit the gas on moderate up-hills, so now you have less air resistance but the guy is accelerating on an incline. The more fuel efficient solution is to decel on an incline. Everyone here knows that, but people think hypermiling = draft the semi, which is just a bad impression. Its a knee-jerk response of fear to prevent them from actually thinking about what hypermiling could be.

[jamesqf]

Originally Posted by Natalya

Only contractors and farm or construction workers ever need a big vehicle.

And not even a lot of them. I worked farm & construction for years, often riding a motorcycle to the job site, or driving an Austin-Healey Sprite or a Mazda RX-3. Biggest vehicle I drove (not counting tractors &c) was a '78 Datsun pickup.

[Hersbird]

Or in the movie Jaws, big enough boat anxiety. That sort of turned out to be true, but hey, the guy did come off the USS Indianapolis which was a much bigger boat and didn't solve the shark anxiety, Chief.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u9S41Kplsbs