Go Back   EcoModder Forum > EcoModding > General Efficiency Discussion
Register Now
 Register Now
 

Reply  Post New Thread
 
Submit Tools LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 08-15-2008, 02:41 AM   #11 (permalink)
Pokémoderator
 
cfg83's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Southern California
Posts: 5,864

1999 Saturn SW2 - '99 Saturn SW2 Wagon
Team Saturn
90 day: 40.49 mpg (US)
Thanks: 439
Thanked 528 Times in 355 Posts
iHero -

Quote:
Originally Posted by iHero View Post
Looks like BMW is building a gas / steam hybrid.

BMW Developing a Steam/Gas Hybrid Engine : TreeHugger
I really like this part :

Quote:
Even more impressive: the drive has been designed to be retrofitted into existing gasoline-only Beemers, meaning that the entire fleet of BMWs could incrementally reduce fuel consumption almost overnight.
Retrofit-Mania!!!!

CarloSW2

__________________

What's your EPA MPG? Go Here and find out!
American Solar Energy Society
  Reply With Quote
Alt Today
Popular topics

Other popular topics in this forum...

   
Old 08-15-2008, 05:00 AM   #12 (permalink)
Mr. Blue Tape
 
azraelswrd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Fresno, CA
Posts: 345

AzxA - '06 Scion xA
90 day: 42.72 mpg (US)
Thanks: 0
Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
+15% efficiency with steam boosters? Intriguing...
__________________


My 5 pillars of fuel efficiency:
  • driving style
  • aerodynamics
  • tires
  • weight reduction
  • engine maintenance
  Reply With Quote
Old 09-06-2008, 09:07 AM   #13 (permalink)
EcoModding Lurker
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Dayton
Posts: 22
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Looks like another company working the steam option -- there is obviously something to this idea.

Clean Power Technologies still working on new steam-assisted cars - AutoblogGreen
  Reply With Quote
Old 09-06-2008, 04:13 PM   #14 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
Big Dave's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Steppes of Central Indiana
Posts: 1,313

The Red Baron - '00 Ford F-350 XLT
90 day: 27.99 mpg (US)

Impala Phase Zero - '96 Chevrolet Impala SS
90 day: 21.03 mpg (US)
Thanks: 0
Thanked 183 Times in 124 Posts
Plus 15% efficiency is pure ad-man's hype. Plus 1% would be more like it.

There are a lot of car companies on the ropes and MPG is a hot selling point. If they could really deliver a 15% improvement with Rankine cycle compounding, why don't they? Could it possibly be they know they cannot deliver?
__________________
2000 Ford F-350 SC 4x2 6 Speed Manual
4" Slam
3.08:1 gears and Gear Vendor Overdrive
Rubber Conveyor Belt Air Dam
  Reply With Quote
Old 09-06-2008, 04:26 PM   #15 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Auburn, NH
Posts: 451

Wicked Wanda - '99 VW Beetle GLS
90 day: 29.59 mpg (US)

Green Monster - '99 Ford Explorer Sport
90 day: 16.73 mpg (US)

Dad's Taxi - '99 Honda Odyssey EX
90 day: 24.23 mpg (US)
Thanks: 0
Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
When BMW started working on it in 2005 they predicted it would be 10 years before a production model was ready. There's a ways to go yet.
__________________
  Reply With Quote
Old 09-06-2008, 06:44 PM   #16 (permalink)
EcoModding Lurker
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Dayton
Posts: 22
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
With the amount of heat pooring out of any ICE vehicle after 15 minutes -- a simple design of copper tubing, small turbine and and alternator -- could save a fair amount of gas.

If you have a short commute -- steam will never work except for recharging.
I think the solar collector idea has merit for recharging during work ours too --much more so than solar panels.

I'd build one -- but my two prototypes severly limit any project time.

Right or Wrong ? Does more IR than UV pass through the atmosphere?
  Reply With Quote
Old 09-06-2008, 10:26 PM   #17 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
Big Dave's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Steppes of Central Indiana
Posts: 1,313

The Red Baron - '00 Ford F-350 XLT
90 day: 27.99 mpg (US)

Impala Phase Zero - '96 Chevrolet Impala SS
90 day: 21.03 mpg (US)
Thanks: 0
Thanked 183 Times in 124 Posts
Bill Lear (daddy of the Lear Jet) tried this back in the 70s. It wasn't worth the effort.
__________________
2000 Ford F-350 SC 4x2 6 Speed Manual
4" Slam
3.08:1 gears and Gear Vendor Overdrive
Rubber Conveyor Belt Air Dam
  Reply With Quote
Old 09-06-2008, 10:52 PM   #18 (permalink)
home of the odd vehicles
 
rmay635703's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Somewhere in WI
Posts: 3,316

Silver - '10 Chevy Cobalt XFE
Thanks: 347
Thanked 657 Times in 490 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Big Dave View Post
Plus 15% efficiency is pure ad-man's hype. Plus 1% would be more like it.

There are a lot of car companies on the ropes and MPG is a hot selling point. If they could really deliver a 15% improvement with Rankine cycle compounding, why don't they? Could it possibly be they know they cannot deliver?
Actually plus 30% was a reality on large ship size motors and was employed sucessfully but caused contamination and subsiquent daily maintenance, but a ship also has all the room in the world for such engines, a small version would need to use dangerous low boiling point liquids to be effective, especially given that most of the motors heat goes into the radiator fluid at relatively low temps which is hard to recover usefully.

Given that 50-75% of your motors full energy is lost in the form of heat this is no small energy source, sadly heat is difficult to make locomotion out of.

There is a guy in Australia that has been converting full size cars and trucks to steam since the 70's. A well designed capillary steam engine weighs no more than a standard diesel. But then you have to take care on what type of water you use and again the irritating cleaning.

Well worth more reasearch, main issue developing a fully contained unit like AC to handle the dangerous low boiling point liquids available or a safe low boiling point liquid needs to be developed.

And on a side note, I have long wondered why engine heat wasn't used to make passive AC. It wouldn't require any extra power from the motor and would be Always on for better or worse.
  Reply With Quote
Old 09-07-2008, 09:56 AM   #19 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
Big Dave's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Steppes of Central Indiana
Posts: 1,313

The Red Baron - '00 Ford F-350 XLT
90 day: 27.99 mpg (US)

Impala Phase Zero - '96 Chevrolet Impala SS
90 day: 21.03 mpg (US)
Thanks: 0
Thanked 183 Times in 124 Posts
Bill Lear tried an organic soup he called "Learium" to replace water as his working fluid. Lear found out why water was the better fluid.

You could use an adsorption refrigeration system to cool your car but it would be huge. Adsorption refrigeration is about a third the efficiency of thr Rankine cycle used today.

There is nothing new under the sun. That's completely true in energy technology. Somebody has already tried it. What works is what is in use. What doesn't work is a museum curiosity.

Material and theoretical advances have triggered a few new ideas. Algal biofuels. Aneutronic fusion. Vanadium redox batteries. Not much else.
__________________
2000 Ford F-350 SC 4x2 6 Speed Manual
4" Slam
3.08:1 gears and Gear Vendor Overdrive
Rubber Conveyor Belt Air Dam
  Reply With Quote
Old 09-07-2008, 02:18 PM   #20 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Earth
Posts: 5,209
Thanks: 225
Thanked 808 Times in 592 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Big Dave View Post
There are a lot of car companies on the ropes and MPG is a hot selling point. If they could really deliver a 15% improvement with Rankine cycle compounding, why don't they? Could it possibly be they know they cannot deliver?
Since when has mpg been a big selling point? June, maybe? On experience to date, it takes a LOT longer than 3 months for auto executives to pull their heads out of their butts. Then consider how many years they've spent going in front of Congressional committees and saying that they couldn't POSSIBLY meet those CAFE standards. So now they're supposed to turn around and say "Gee, it looks like we could have done it all along"?

When I think about the actions of the auto manufacturers since the '70s oil embargo, and even before, I can only conclude that they simply don't WANT to make cars that get good mpg.

  Reply With Quote
Reply  Post New Thread


Thread Tools


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Converting Exhaust Heat to Electricity SuperTrooper General Efficiency Discussion 13 03-20-2010 06:03 AM
1992 Metro sedan needs a new engine - What/Where/How - advice appreciated greatly! Crono EcoModding Central 26 11-18-2008 01:42 AM
Heat engine block for efficiency? bennelson EcoModding Central 43 08-12-2008 09:45 PM
Moving air intake into the engine compartment? pasadena_commut Aerodynamics 5 07-25-2008 03:24 PM
Coasting experiment: engine on VS engine off on a fixed route = 12.9% gain MetroMPG Hypermiling / EcoDriver's Ed 6 02-22-2008 08:38 AM



Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.5.2
All content copyright EcoModder.com