Toyota commits back to electification

[botsapper]

Toyota has quietly redirected their focus back to EVs as they believe that more cleaner carbon-neutral electricity are being generated. Their early launch with hybrid-electric cars and then their strategic move towards hydrogen fuel cell vehicles may have changed and have gone back to 'electrification' and are improving their next-gen plugin technologies and cars. They will be "using more electricity in the future." Toyota Chief Engineer Hints of Shift Toward More Battery Electrification

[oil pan 4]

No body that knows anything about hydrogen wants anything to do with hydrogen, so that makes sense.

[RedDevil]

So the Mirai was a mirage after all. Who would have thought.

[MetroMPG]

What's interesting:

You can isolate & store hydrogen using renewable electricity, so technically more "cleaner" electricity coming online is no reason to shift from H fuel cells to battery electric vehicles (BEVs).

It ignores the fact that the BEV is a more energy efficient use of that electricity in the first place, but fuel cell proponents like that tech for other advantages (faster filling, range).

I saw a reference recently that it would cost a trillion dollars to put hydrogen in all the gas stations in the U.S. Maybe the reality of that chicken & egg scenario is the real reason for the shift in focus. Whereas PHEV's with moderately sized packs can easily be re-charged from ubiquitous 110v outlets (eg. current Chevy Volt = 8 hours from completely empty; other PHEV's take less time than that).

[NeilBlanchard]

Hydrogen source, transport, and filling stations will never happen on a scale they are needed. From here: API | Service Station FAQs "as of 2/28/2014 there were 152,995 locations nationwide selling gasoline, including service stations, truck stops, convenience stores and marinas." So, let's say there are ~150,000 gas stations for vehicles. On average, I think each services ~25 vehicles a day?

That's as much as 3.75 million fillups per day.

Typical hydrogen filling stations can service just 15 vehicles per day, so that means we would need ~250,000 hydrogen filling stations. They each cost ~$2M.

That is $500,000,000,000 for the filling stations alone.

If we could build TEN PER DAY, 365 days a year - we would be finished building them by 2085.

[oil pan 4]

With hydrogen versus electricity its more of a problem of no fueling versus slow recharge.
Far as I am concerned slow recharge wins every day of the week over no available fuel.

[roflwaffle]

It only took 'em 12+ years to get back on the horse...

The Eco-Car Engineers - Innovators - TIME

Right now, Hori and his team are focused on the future. "The original Prius proved that hybrid cars were technically feasible. The new model has shown that it can be attractive to consumers. The third generation has to be even more powerful and more fuel efficient," says Hori. His vision for Toyota's eco-friendly autos goes beyond the Prius line. "The next step is to apply hybrid technology to other models, and to reduce its price," he says. After that, he has his sights on dispensing with CO2-belching gasoline engines entirely: "Ultimately, the future is in electric power." It might sound like an eco-platitude. But if someone is going to bring an electric car to your driveway, there's a good chance Hori will be the one to do it.

[oil pan 4]

Liquid at room temperature fuel is not going away any time soon.