Go Back   EcoModder Forum > EcoModding > Fossil Fuel Free
Register Now
 Register Now
 

Reply  Post New Thread
 
Submit Tools LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 12-25-2008, 10:58 AM   #1 (permalink)
Batman Junior
 
MetroMPG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: 1000 Islands, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 22,054

Blackfly - '98 Geo Metro
Team Metro
Last 3: 70.09 mpg (US)

MPGiata - '90 Mazda Miata
90 day: 53.56 mpg (US)

Winter beater Metro - '00 Chevrolet Metro
90 day: 61.98 mpg (US)

Fancy Metro - '14 Mitsubishi Mirage top spec
90 day: 58.72 mpg (US)

Even Fancier Metro - '14 Mitsubishi Mirage top spec
90 day: 58.34 mpg (US)
Thanks: 3,699
Thanked 6,508 Times in 3,372 Posts
Toyota jumping on the 100% EV bandwagon at 2009 Detroit show

Can't have BWM's electric Mini and Mitsubishi's electric i MiEV stealing the spotlight all the time, now can they? (Not to mention GM's Volt.)

So apparently Toyota will be showing a 100% EV concept at the Detroit auto show in a few weeks.

Not their first EV, of course. They have real world experience building/leasing/crushing and selling and RAV-4 EV's in the mid-90's.

If it weren't for the current economic climate, I wonder if they'll roll out an EV "lease only" evaluation/greenwashing program...

Source: http://www.greencarcongress.com/2008...-to-unvei.html

__________________
Latest mods: 3-cylinder Mitsubishi Mirage. EcoMods now in progress...
Ecodriving test:
Manual vs. automatic transmission MPG showdown



EcoModder
has launched a forum for the efficient new Mitsubishi Mirage
www.MetroMPG.com - fuel efficiency info for Geo Metro owners
www.ForkenSwift.com - electric car conversion on a beer budget
  Reply With Quote
Alt Today
Popular topics

Other popular topics in this forum...

   
Old 01-02-2009, 09:23 AM   #2 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Auburn, NH
Posts: 451

Wicked Wanda - '99 VW Beetle GLS
90 day: 29.59 mpg (US)

Green Monster - '99 Ford Explorer Sport
90 day: 16.73 mpg (US)

Dad's Taxi - '99 Honda Odyssey EX
90 day: 24.23 mpg (US)
Thanks: 0
Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
For all the bashing GM takes for the EV-1 program, I never understood why Toyota has gotten a free pass for doing exactly the same thing with the RAV-4 EVs. As soon as CARB eliminated the EV requirements rules, Toyota did all it could to make people forget the RAV-4 EV ever existed.
__________________
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-02-2009, 12:13 PM   #3 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
basjoos's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Upstate SC
Posts: 1,064

Aerocivic - '92 Honda Civic CX
Last 3: 70.54 mpg (US)

AerocivicLB - '92 Honda Civic CX
Team Honda
90 day: 55.14 mpg (US)

Camryglide - '20 Toyota Camry hybrid LE
90 day: 60.53 mpg (US)
Thanks: 10
Thanked 613 Times in 283 Posts
Toyota and Panasonic were sued by Chevron (who bought the patent from GM) for 30 million dollars for infringing on their patent for large format Ni-MH batteries, so they couldn't make any more batteries for the RAV4EV. So after losing a bunch of money on the small-scale RAV4EV program and not being able to get any more batteries for the EV's, so naturally they dropped the EV program once CARB eliminated the EV requirement. At least Toyota is still supporting the RAV4EV's they sold through their dealer network, rather then sending them all to the crusher and washing their hands of the matter like GM did with the EV-1.
__________________
aerocivic.com
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-03-2009, 09:01 PM   #4 (permalink)
Batman Junior
 
MetroMPG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: 1000 Islands, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 22,054

Blackfly - '98 Geo Metro
Team Metro
Last 3: 70.09 mpg (US)

MPGiata - '90 Mazda Miata
90 day: 53.56 mpg (US)

Winter beater Metro - '00 Chevrolet Metro
90 day: 61.98 mpg (US)

Fancy Metro - '14 Mitsubishi Mirage top spec
90 day: 58.72 mpg (US)

Even Fancier Metro - '14 Mitsubishi Mirage top spec
90 day: 58.34 mpg (US)
Thanks: 3,699
Thanked 6,508 Times in 3,372 Posts
My understanding is that Toyota intended to reposess (and destroy?) all the Rav4 EV's until EV proponents put public pressure on the company. Only after that did they relent and permit lease customers to buy them.

See Plug In America - DontCrush.com Campaign to Save RAV4 EVs
__________________
Latest mods: 3-cylinder Mitsubishi Mirage. EcoMods now in progress...
Ecodriving test:
Manual vs. automatic transmission MPG showdown



EcoModder
has launched a forum for the efficient new Mitsubishi Mirage
www.MetroMPG.com - fuel efficiency info for Geo Metro owners
www.ForkenSwift.com - electric car conversion on a beer budget
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-04-2009, 03:26 AM   #5 (permalink)
PaulH
 
MPaulHolmes's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Maricopa, AZ (sort of. Actually outside of town)
Posts: 3,832

Michael's Electric Beetle - '71 Volkswagen Superbeetle 500000
Thanks: 1,368
Thanked 1,119 Times in 734 Posts
One of the sad things was that Panasonic made some pretty dramatic improvements on the life of the large size NiMH when compared to the Ovonics (Chevron/cobasys) NiMH. That makes me sad that they are allowed to perpetrate such patent encumbrance. I wish the law was use it or lose it with respect to patents.
__________________
kits and boards
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-04-2009, 03:34 AM   #6 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
roflwaffle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Southern California
Posts: 1,490

Camryaro - '92 Toyota Camry LE V6
90 day: 31.12 mpg (US)

Red - '00 Honda Insight

Prius - '05 Toyota Prius

3 - '18 Tesla Model 3
90 day: 152.47 mpg (US)
Thanks: 349
Thanked 120 Times in 79 Posts
I still see a RAV-4 EV (SoCal Edison) in my grandparent's neighborhood once in a while so Panasonic/Toyota evidently did something right. I should see if I can snap a picture of the odometer one of these days.

Last edited by roflwaffle; 01-04-2009 at 05:37 PM..
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-17-2009, 02:21 AM   #7 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
orange4boy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: The Wet Coast, Kanuckistan.
Posts: 1,272

The Golden Egg - '93 Toyota Previa DX
90 day: 31.91 mpg (US)

Chewie - '03 Toyota Prius
90 day: 57 mpg (US)

The Spaceship - '00 Honda Insight
Thanks: 98
Thanked 297 Times in 174 Posts
Why the volt is bull***t

Here is a video done by a RAV 4 owner who has hacked it to charge off his solar panels. His delivery is a bit annoying but he's dead right.

__________________
Vortex generators are old tech. My new and improved vortex alternators are unstoppable.

"Itís easy to explain how rockets work but explaining how a wing works takes a rocket scientist."
-Philippe Spalart


  Reply With Quote
Old 01-17-2009, 11:01 AM   #8 (permalink)
PaulH
 
MPaulHolmes's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Maricopa, AZ (sort of. Actually outside of town)
Posts: 3,832

Michael's Electric Beetle - '71 Volkswagen Superbeetle 500000
Thanks: 1,368
Thanked 1,119 Times in 734 Posts
I heard Allen (alan?) Cacconi (sp?), the developer of the EV1 controller, left GM because of their insistance on using an idiotic charger that couldn't just plug into a 110 or 220 outlet. So, that guy "hacked" an electric car to plug into 110 (110 that came from solar). The hack would have been completely unnecessary if they would have done the charging interface right in the first place.
__________________
kits and boards
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-17-2009, 04:12 PM   #9 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
orange4boy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: The Wet Coast, Kanuckistan.
Posts: 1,272

The Golden Egg - '93 Toyota Previa DX
90 day: 31.91 mpg (US)

Chewie - '03 Toyota Prius
90 day: 57 mpg (US)

The Spaceship - '00 Honda Insight
Thanks: 98
Thanked 297 Times in 174 Posts
I actually corresponded to a lawyer who specializes in patent law and is an activist in the area of patent abuse and it turns out patents are use it or lose it to some extent. I asked him about the Texaco patent sitting on the ovonic batteries. The problem is they are manufacturing the ovonic batteries and using them to hybridize some courier trucks. (Purolater perhaps?)

Since GM sold the patent they can just say that they are too expensive to buy or are not a "fit" for their product or just design the cars "wrong" Never mind that there are still 700ish RAV4s kicking around, some with over 120 000 miles on their battery packs. Just try to pry an owner from their RAV4 EV.

One ray of sunshine to this story is this:
Quote:
Cobasys is the only seller of nickel metal hydride batteries in North America, a competitive advantage it will hold until 2010, when a court settlement barring Matsu****a Electronic Industrial Co., Panasonic EV Energy Co. and Toyota Motor Co. from selling the batteries in North America is lifted.
Part of a story on Cobasys here:
The real problem IMO is that corporations have too much freedom. Corporate charters used to be granted for specific purposes and if the company was doing bad stuff, like patent sitting, the government could yank the charter or change it. As it is they can pretty much do what ever they want, people having forgotten the whole purpose of incorporation (to make sure these organizations don't use their power improperly against the public) and governments loath to do anything lest they be called anti business and purloined in the, you guessed it, corporate owned media.

A sad state of affairs really.
__________________
Vortex generators are old tech. My new and improved vortex alternators are unstoppable.

"Itís easy to explain how rockets work but explaining how a wing works takes a rocket scientist."
-Philippe Spalart


  Reply With Quote
Old 08-10-2010, 12:26 AM   #10 (permalink)
Mod Rookie
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Georgia
Posts: 14
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Well, here we are in 2010, what's the situation?

__________________
Rice is great when you're hungry for 2000 of something.
  Reply With Quote
Reply  Post New Thread


Thread Tools


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Rumor Mill: GM To Eebut E-Flex Cadillac in January at Detroit Auto Show Matt Herring General Efficiency Discussion 0 12-19-2008 03:32 PM
Review: 2009 Toyota Corolla LE (37.9 MPG) RH77 General Efficiency Discussion 22 05-09-2008 04:55 PM



Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.5.2
All content copyright EcoModder.com