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Old 04-30-2020, 10:29 AM   #21 (permalink)
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You seem to have overlooked the Fresno/bakersfield eddy, the shoddy air quality of Sacramento, or San Diego. The State of Jackson is pretty clean, but it is agricultural with low population density. Your attached chart illustrates those places

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Old 04-30-2020, 11:44 AM   #22 (permalink)
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Oil Pan- Dead wrong about air quality in CA. I vaguely remember how bad LA air was in the 80s. Much better today.

States have the right to impose their own regulatory standards. It must at least meet the maximums set by the federal government, but they are responsible for managing their environment and determining what is acceptable. The challenges of maintaining environmental standards in Montana are way different than maintaining environmental standards in SoCal.
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Old 04-30-2020, 12:51 PM   #23 (permalink)
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Ram is selling the most unreliable hybrid V6 and V8 trucks
fixed it for you
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Old 04-30-2020, 01:26 PM   #24 (permalink)
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I didn't know Ram had a hybrid. Just read up on it, and the details were pretty light. It seems it can barely recover any energy on decel, though how much wasn't disclosed. The article also said the electric motor assists with the first 1/2 rotation of the wheels, which is practically nothing. Essentially it's starting the engine and that's it.

The article says it's much more than engine start/stop, but went on to pretty much just describe start/stop.

Can't wait for a true hybrid pickup to become available. Absolutely insane that it wasn't the first hybrid to be released 20 years ago. It stands the most to benefit from the technology, is least impacted by the bulk and weight of the batteries, and has the fastest payback period. What am I missing? What does the industry know that I don't?
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Old 04-30-2020, 01:37 PM   #25 (permalink)
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I didn't know Ram had a hybrid. Just read up on it, and the details were pretty light. It seems it can barely recover any energy on decel, though how much wasn't disclosed. The article also said the electric motor assists with the first 1/2 rotation of the wheels, which is practically nothing. Essentially it's starting the engine and that's it.

The article says it's much more than engine start/stop, but went on to pretty much just describe start/stop.

Can't wait for a true hybrid pickup to become available. Absolutely insane that it wasn't the first hybrid to be released 20 years ago. It stands the most to benefit from the technology, is least impacted by the bulk and weight of the batteries, and has the fastest payback period. What am I missing? What does the industry know that I don't?
it's a mild hybrid basically a unreliable BAS mild hybrid :S

it's highly optimized to get VERY HIGH EPA numbers (might be cheating )

not real life driving numbers
it's not very impressive
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Old 04-30-2020, 03:45 PM   #26 (permalink)
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I think the imports tried to over Americanize their trucks.

The fed should burn the individual state tail pipe emissions requirements. States like California have been trying to regulate exhaust emissions to clean their smoggy air for 50 years and it hasn't worked. Yes there is less smog compared to decades past, but they still come at worst air quality in the nation, so literally everyone has been able to clean their air better than California without their own emissions standards. So the only thing that will work is pollution exportation, generate power and air pollution up north and in other states and send it to the smog capitals.
Yes pollution is likely worse in California than most other states. But California has a population of over 40,000,000 people. The next closest is Texas at around 30,000,000 and a few states at about half of that. Why do you think they have tougher standards? And yes the standards do make a difference as you noted in your post. I remember how brown the skies were back in the 70's in LA. Not nearly as bad now.
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Old 04-30-2020, 05:24 PM   #27 (permalink)
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Oil Pan- Dead wrong about air quality in CA. I vaguely remember how bad LA air was in the 80s. Much better today.

States have the right to impose their own regulatory standards. It must at least meet the maximums set by the federal government, but they are responsible for managing their environment and determining what is acceptable. The challenges of maintaining environmental standards in Montana are way different than maintaining environmental standards in SoCal.
I said that the air quality has improved over the decades, but they still have the worst air quality in the nation. How is that incorrect?
Better is nice, but they still come in last place and last place sucks, what do they want a participation trophy?
The only thing that can make them not last place is lots of electrics.
Then every other state has been able to clean up their sky's better and faster with out imposing their own standards.
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Old 04-30-2020, 05:29 PM   #28 (permalink)
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Yes pollution is likely worse in California than most other states. But California has a population of over 40,000,000 people. The next closest is Texas at around 30,000,000 and a few states at about half of that. Why do you think they have tougher standards? And yes the standards do make a difference as you noted in your post. I remember how brown the skies were back in the 70's in LA. Not nearly as bad now.
JJ
I have no doubt it's better. But they do rank worst across the board. When you play stupid games like cram million upon millions of people into a city and then sprawl the suburbs out further than the eye can see you win stupid prizes like worst air quality in the nation.
All I wonder is how long are they going to do the same thing and expect a different result before they fix it?
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Old 04-30-2020, 05:33 PM   #29 (permalink)
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I didn't know Ram had a hybrid. Just read up on it, and the details were pretty light. It seems it can barely recover any energy on decel, though how much wasn't disclosed. The article also said the electric motor assists with the first 1/2 rotation of the wheels, which is practically nothing. Essentially it's starting the engine and that's it.

The article says it's much more than engine start/stop, but went on to pretty much just describe start/stop.

Can't wait for a true hybrid pickup to become available. Absolutely insane that it wasn't the first hybrid to be released 20 years ago. It stands the most to benefit from the technology, is least impacted by the bulk and weight of the batteries, and has the fastest payback period. What am I missing? What does the industry know that I don't?
The industry know about 12 years ago someone tried it.
GM built a hybrid Silverado back around 2008. It flopped, there were still new ones on dealer lots 2 years after they discontinued them. This is the main reason no one is trying to be first with an electric or hybrid pickups.

They developed a bit of a cult following after gas prices were stuck over $3 a gallon for a few years by 2013-2014.

So the industry knows gas prices will have to go up and stay up for an extended period of time to get people interested..

With the auto makers bleeding money from every orifice like an ebola victim no one can afford to launch a money pit.
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Last edited by oil pan 4; 04-30-2020 at 05:38 PM..
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Old 04-30-2020, 05:50 PM   #30 (permalink)
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Only 25% of the Ford F-150s sold in 2018 had a V8 under the hood. 65% are sold with turbocharged V6s and 10% go for the base V-6.
Either the base V6 or the EcoBoost are still no rocket-science at all. On a sidenote, considering the F-150 had been used as a test mule for the Achates Power opposed-piston engines, had it been developed in-house I guess Ford would go further and effectively release at least the Diesel one instead of the Lion V6 which frankly is a nightmare to service.


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GM is selling the Silverado with a 4 cylinder turbo that makes 310 hp and 348 lb-ft of torque
Does it outnumber the conservative naturally-aspirated V6 and V8 pushrod ones?


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Ram is selling hybrid V6 and V8 trucks
There have been some arguments to which extent a BAS-Hybrid effectively qualifies as a real hybrid anyway.


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All of them sell full size trucks today that meet the original 2025 fuel economy target. They don't need full hybrids to meet the very low bar set by the NHTSA
Let's wait how long it would take for them to raise the bar, even though EPA and NHTSA have been historically more lenient when it comes to full-size trucks and SUVs.

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