well my '01 civic just ate it....new ride time!

[War_Wagon]

In the wholesale world, an '04 Cavalier with decent miles is a $1000 car. They are worthless, always have been, always will be. If you were going to drive it into the ground then it doesn't matter, but if you want something that holds its value to a degree, avoid those things. Value depends on demand, so you need to pick something that people actively seek out - I mean I like Saturns, but how many people that just need a car get up in the morning and search for an SL1 on Craigslist? Stick with a Honda or a Toyota if you want it to retain any value at all.

And the older/cheaper the car, the less the KBB etc matters. The numbers get screwy in the value guides after 6 or 7 model years as they are based on transactions, and as cars age the number of transactions drop, so an anomaly in either direction on the price for one transaction messes up the average. But more important than that, once a car gets to be that old or older, the value is in the condition and mileage, not anything else. The "book" might say to add say $400 for "low mileage/extra clean", but in reality, a 2004 Civic with 40,000 miles is worth WAY more than a 2004 Civic with 140,000 miles.

If you can find a really low mile, clean example of something, pay more for it, it will always be worth more when you resell it as the number of comparables to it in the market will have dropped. I had a mint '98 Tracker 4 door, super low miles, all the right options, good colour combo, last year of the body style, it was THE Tracker you'd want if you wanted a Tracker. You couldn't find that truck again if you wanted to. I wanted a lot of money for it, and some guy looked at it and broke out the "book value" pages he had printed off the internet to show me my price was too high. "So buy one from the book" I told him. "Well, the book doesn't sell cars." he said. "Exactly". My opinion is free so take it for what it's worth, but if you want to buy a cheaper car and have it maintain its value, pay more for a nice one, then by the time you are done with it it's still worth what an average one is worth. And not $1000 like a Cavalier ha ha.

[doless]

Originally Posted by War_Wagon

In the wholesale world, an '04 Cavalier with decent miles is a $1000 car. They are worthless, always have been, always will be. If you were going to drive it into the ground then it doesn't matter, but if you want something that holds its value to a degree, avoid those things. Value depends on demand, so you need to pick something that people actively seek out - I mean I like Saturns, but how many people that just need a car get up in the morning and search for an SL1 on Craigslist? Stick with a Honda or a Toyota if you want it to retain any value at all.

And the older/cheaper the car, the less the KBB etc matters. The numbers get screwy in the value guides after 6 or 7 model years as they are based on transactions, and as cars age the number of transactions drop, so an anomaly in either direction on the price for one transaction messes up the average. But more important than that, once a car gets to be that old or older, the value is in the condition and mileage, not anything else. The "book" might say to add say $400 for "low mileage/extra clean", but in reality, a 2004 Civic with 40,000 miles is worth WAY more than a 2004 Civic with 140,000 miles.

If you can find a really low mile, clean example of something, pay more for it, it will always be worth more when you resell it as the number of comparables to it in the market will have dropped. I had a mint '98 Tracker 4 door, super low miles, all the right options, good colour combo, last year of the body style, it was THE Tracker you'd want if you wanted a Tracker. You couldn't find that truck again if you wanted to. I wanted a lot of money for it, and some guy looked at it and broke out the "book value" pages he had printed off the internet to show me my price was too high. "So buy one from the book" I told him. "Well, the book doesn't sell cars." he said. "Exactly". My opinion is free so take it for what it's worth, but if you want to buy a cheaper car and have it maintain its value, pay more for a nice one, then by the time you are done with it it's still worth what an average one is worth. And not $1000 like a Cavalier ha ha.

good advice, i'll narrow it to a honda or toyota then.

The problem i'm having is every civic or corolla with low miles has a automatic trans! I found a perfect 03 civic wiith 85k miles for 3400 but it's an autmatic, i'll be going through more listing tonight and trying to reorganize.

Thanks for the post though!

[War_Wagon]

Older people generally buy new automatics, and older people don't usually drive as much/can usually afford to take better care of their stuff, so yes sadly most of the really clean, low mile stuff will be automatic. I see a lot of cars every week, and one of the few things that actually catches my eye is a low mileage/clean car with a 3rd pedal on the floor. They are out there, but you really have to search for them.

[doless]

Toyota Corolla Model 2000

well i FINALLY found a 2000 corolla with 118k miles and it's a stick for $2500 asking.

Emailed him asking about the clutch/tires/brakes/how long he's owned it.

I didn't expect it'd be this hard to find a stick cheaper, seems most everyone can only drive automatics nowadays, it makes sense older folks not wanting the hassle though.

[jeff88]

That's a good car, decent price. Some things to consider/ask owner:

*He might say it doesn't leak oil, but it may or may not burn it. The 1ZZ for this generation is pretty notorious for burning oil. Sometimes you get lucky and can find a gem. Other times you have to constantly add oil or rebuild the engine with bigger oil return holes on the pistons.
*I don't think that spoiler is OEM, you should double check the seals, make sure it doesn't leak.
*Looks like there is no tach. Either get some sort of scangauge or similar (you should do that anyway) or swap in a newer gauge cluster from another Corolla (like my 2001).
*Check for rust, it is Mighigan after all!

I'm not trying to scare you out of this car, it is a good car with good FE. Just want to help you do your homework, before you pull the trigger.

Good luck!

[doless]

right, i'll be sure to check all around the engine, drive it, smell it, all that jazz for leaks.

I'm more concerned about wearable parts condition, new brakes/tires/clutch will run another 1000+ alone.

Didn't notice the lack of tach, kind of weird in a manual trans....

I'm going to see it tomorrow though, we'll see how it holds up to inspection. He mentioned he's owner it 4 months and used it to get to school but now he carpools with his buddy but he hasn't ever done the timing belt or water pump, of course owner prior to him might have.

good advice though!

[War_Wagon]

From looking at that ad, I would guess it's either a curber that got that car super cheap, or someone that inherited it. The bumper sticker on the trunk has been there a long time, but that tacky aftermarket spoiler and steering wheel cover is new-ish. If that car was up here, I could probably tell you what neighborhood you'd find that car in just from the way it's written and how the car looks ha ha, but as a general guess I'd say some kid got his grandfathers car, put a spoiler on it, then decided to sell it. If I had to guess by looking at it, I wouldn't think a lot of money has been spent on regular maintenance, so if you do go look at it, please do yourself a favor and get it checked out by a mechanic. Good luck.

[doless]

Yeah the fact he only owned it 4 months really kind of puts me off.

The problem with craigslist is i have to use the metro detroit one even though i'm an hour up from detroit in oakland county (all good areas) and junk ads clutter everything.

You can't even look at most ads from dearborn as that's where all the dealers and arab guys stay, they buy salvage cars and roll back the miles and stuff.

I'll still probably go check it out, but definitely won't be buying until i see a few. he lives in troy which is a good area, and the fact that it's a timing chain not a belt makes me fairly partial to the early corolla without having ever driven one.

[P-hack]

Originally Posted by doless

Toyota Corolla Model 2000

Am I the only one that gets irked when people put "V4" in the ads?

[UltArc]

War Wagon made some good points- and often a Honda or Toyota is more desirable than a similar car by a NA company, GM, Ford.

But keep in mind, cars get to a point where they just can't lose any more value. There is a terminal point that the price gets to, and you won't see any less. If it can roll down a hill, the engine turns over, and all the major hinges open, it's generally worth ~$500.

So yes, a $2500 Civic may be worth more two years later than a $1000 Saturn, but what is the percent of loss? Repair costs are not as important with these cars, they are generally cheap to repair- we're not comparing a Maserati/Ferrari to a Civic.

If you don't want to invest so much, you can get something cheaper and just maintain it. I remember a Top Gear episode where they came to the US, bought used cars, drove across the country, then sold them back. If you find a car for $500, and you don't ruin it, then theres no reason to NOT see at least $500 back.