What would you pay for a 100mpg Diesel electric Hybrid?

[GreenHornet]

It would be awesome if someone designed a 100 mpg 5 seater I would most definitely be up for buying it

Maybe that can be my next project after I finish up with the TIGON Hybrid!

[PressEnter[]]

I think $25K sounds reasonable, but for everyday driving, I really do need 4 doors and decent cargo space.

[mechman600]

Getting a modern [clean] diesel to work in a hybrid application will be difficult, given the start/stop nature of a hybrid. Diesel aftertreatment systems need frequent steady state operation to be able to regenerate the DPF. Stop/Start city operation would soot load a DPF pretty quick, making a run out to the highway for a "burn" necessary every few days.

If you go on VW forums, the general consensus is that any commute less than 7 miles spells trouble for a clean diesel, and that's lightly loaded stop and go, not stop/start which will mean even lower EGTs and less regeneration opportunity.

[SoobieOut]

Appears that Volvo has is introducing a car that meets your goals:

Volvo Bringing 100+ MPG, V60 Diesel Hybrid Wagon to 2013 NY Auto Show!

No price mentioned but I would assume it's $70K or more.

The problem is the high cost of batteries.

I would only pay $30K.

[user removed]

45 MPG for my Fiesta is 2222 gallons versus 1000 gallons at 100 MPG, for 100k miles.. At $5 per gallon that's $6110 in additional fuel cost. I paid $10k for the Fiesta. Would I pay another $6119 for 100 MPG? Sure, but at that additional up front cost I am breaking even after 100 k miles.

How much will the Fiesta be worth at 103k miles compared to the 100 MPG car's depreciation at the same mileage? I would guess the depreciation would be more than I paid for the Fiesta, probably a lot more.

Now let's say I buy a used Leaf for $19k, and ignore the wife's complaining about the higher electricity bill. I guess I already have the option of buying a 100 MPG car as long as I am willing to accept the limited range.

I have the cash to make that purchase, but it is still sitting in the bank.

regards
Mech

[jamesqf]

Originally Posted by mechman600

Getting a modern [clean] diesel to work in a hybrid application will be difficult, given the start/stop nature of a hybrid.

But a hybrid doesn't have to be stop-start, particularly a plug-in with reasonable all-electric range. The engine should only run (simplistically) when the battery is depleted to a set level, and would run long enough, at a high & steady load, to bring the battery up to full charge. So the engine would only be running at that steady state, which AFAIK would be the best possible conditions for the aftertreatment systems.

[GreenHornet]

Originally Posted by MorphDaCivic

Appears that Volvo has is introducing a car that meets your goals:

Volvo Bringing 100+ MPG, V60 Diesel Hybrid Wagon to 2013 NY Auto Show!

No price mentioned but I would assume it's $70K or more.

The problem is the high cost of batteries.

I would only pay $30K.

Thanks for sharing the Volvo!

I did a little research into its cost and the base price was set at 57,000 Euros or $75,200 USD

The US MPG is right at 99 mpg for it which is really good since it has a 5 cylinder 2.4L TDI.

Here is the article source I got the figures from if anyone would like to read more about the car = Volvo Announces Pricing for V60 Plug-in Wagon - HybridCars.com

[PressEnter[]]

For the price of that Volvo you could almost buy 2 Volts :/

[GreenHornet]

Originally Posted by mechman600

Getting a modern [clean] diesel to work in a hybrid application will be difficult, given the start/stop nature of a hybrid. Diesel aftertreatment systems need frequent steady state operation to be able to regenerate the DPF. Stop/Start city operation would soot load a DPF pretty quick, making a run out to the highway for a "burn" necessary every few days.

If you go on VW forums, the general consensus is that any commute less than 7 miles spells trouble for a clean diesel, and that's lightly loaded stop and go, not stop/start which will mean even lower EGTs and less regeneration opportunity.

The Urea injection systems used now a days on the larger diesel rigs are fairly maintenance free just change out the Urea every 5,000 miles or so and you are good similar to an oil change but much easier. All you have to do is just buy the Urea and open the cap and poor it in like windshield washer fluid. The GM cars are set up to come to a steady crawl if the Urea is not replenished So if you ignore the on board diagnostics the car will only go about 15mph LOL!

With a small displacement diesel and set up properly you may not even need the Urea injection or you could use a better solution inexpensive water/methanol injection. Water injection has been known for many years to help reduce particulates can't get much cheaper than this!

If you are driving in the urban areas you may not even have to run the diesel much if it is a plug in electric hybrid which most all manufacturers are moving to anyways.

You are correct on the 7 mi point! It takes time for any engine to warm up to operating temps and diesels like to run hard. So this is part of the reason performance will suffer. Most all vehicles today are lightly loaded so this further compounds the issue. A hybrid allows you to minimize this downfall. You can purposely downsize the diesel engine while the electric can be sized for the heavy starting and acceleration demands.

[GreenHornet]

Originally Posted by PressEnter[]

For the price of that Volvo you could almost buy 2 Volts :/

Ya no doubt I think its pretty crazy that its priced over 70K USD. The crazier thing is they will most likely sale them too