Do we really need all that safety stuff?

[jcp123]

Originally Posted by niky

Which one?

Checking MSRP for the 1960-65 Impalas, the base model pans out to about $19.7 to $20k in its cheapest year. (Other years, it comes out much higher) For a 135 (gross) horsepower four-door that hit 60 in over 16 seconds.

A Camry has roughly the same interior volume, has 178 horsepower (new SAE net, that would be around 200+ gross), and hits 60 mph in just over 8 seconds. And I'm pretty sure it gets over twice the fuel economy on more stringent EPA tests. And I do believe an automatic transmission, AC, infotainment, ABS and power windows and locks come standard.

(looking it up... keyless, cruise and power seats come standard, too.)

I'm pretty sure the extra $2k-$3k is justified... and can probably be eliminated by dumping the luxury kit.

-

Looking it up, you could get a V8 for not much more, but the 250-ish hp V8 is still slower than the I4 Camry.

Ok, my mistake. Impy started at just under $21k, inflation adjusted. I must have been looking at base models.

Still, you could get a brand-new, full-size Chevy in top trim level for $21k. A lot less than now. Something other than inflation accounts for that.

Another reason why I am not a fan of modern cars.

And why I'm building a REAL car next time, not a plastic-and-computer thing on wheels where people these days complain that their infotainment and other crap which really has nothing to do with motivating a car down the road, doesn't work properly.

Ugh.

Maybe I'll ditch the wagon after all and build that hairy little T roadster after all. No carpet, no radio, no heater, no worries.

[redpoint5]

Speaking of cost vs price, I wish the auto industry could just sell direct to the customer instead of funneling us through the stealerships. That's one huge advantage of being a Tesla customer.

Why am I forced to pay someone else to tell me what I want to buy (salesmen)?

[jcp123]

The only advantage is that a GOOD dealer is able to provide feedback to the manufacturer through warrantee work, and that a GOOD dealer can also be an advocate when your situation is bad.

Otherwise, I say why not.

[Hersbird]

Originally Posted by duncan

Yes but they won't
You guys can't even buy decent chocolate!
Hershey put a stop to the guy that was importing it

I would never say never, Rand Paul is looking like a strong contender for 2016. Or maybe some states might step up and say there is no federal authority to dictate safety standards of cars sold in their states. Why can some states have helmet laws and others do not?

[redpoint5]

California will always screw the other states. They make their own silly laws, and because the state has so many consumers, manufacturers build a single product to meet CA requirements.

CARB shouldn't even be something I know about, as an Oregon resident.

[IamIan]

Originally Posted by Hersbird

Or maybe some states might step up and say there is no federal authority to dictate safety standards of cars sold in their states.

AFAIK they already tried this in the past... it doesn't work.

AFAIK it is not 'direct' ... federal 'authority' .. instead it's ... Federal $$$ comes with strings of X,Y, and Z... if state doesn't 'voluntarily' do as told .. they don't get the federal funding.

As long as a State is 'dependent' on federal funding ... they are dependent , just like a crack addict... they will do whatever they have to .. for their next fix.

Like in 1986 when Nevada as a state called out this 'you don't have the authority' to make me ... kind of thinking for speed limit laws ... the federal government .. agreed .. and said .. ok we don't have the "authority" to "Force" you .. but we also don't have to give you any federal money either ... and as soon as the Federal Highway Association pulled ALL federal funding $$ going to the state ... Nevada fell in line and did what they were told to do , in exchange for getting the federal money back.

[gone-ot]

The Fed$ put their money on the ground and the State$ bend over to "pick it up" (wink,wink).

[jcp123]

Pretty much how the fed$ work. Ki$$ our a$$e$ or el$e.

And people think I'm weird for being a libertarian. I rather liked Gary Johnson.

[Hersbird]

Montana was smarter then the feds on the speed limit and just made the fine $5. FU Jimmy Carter!

[niky]

Originally Posted by jcp123

Ok, my mistake. Impy started at just under $21k, inflation adjusted. I must have been looking at base models.

Still, you could get a brand-new, full-size Chevy in top trim level for $21k. A lot less than now. Something other than inflation accounts for that.

Another reason why I am not a fan of modern cars.

And why I'm building a REAL car next time, not a plastic-and-computer thing on wheels where people these days complain that their infotainment and other crap which really has nothing to do with motivating a car down the road, doesn't work properly.

Ugh.

Maybe I'll ditch the wagon after all and build that hairy little T roadster after all. No carpet, no radio, no heater, no worries.

Again, though... it's worth noting that everything that came on the top of the line Impala V8 is already standard on the base Camry (which has the same amount of usable space, and remember, is actually faster than the V8 Impala). And the "base" Camry nowadays already has a lot of stuff you could never get on a 60's Impala.

It's often easy to take for granted what you get as standard with cars nowadays. While I would rather do without dual clutch transmission, fiddly direct injection and glitchy integrated infotainment systems that keep a car from starting when they crash, the amount of standard kit you can get on cars nowadays for very little money is astounding.

As long as you go for stuff that eschews variable geometry turbocharging, direct injection, dual clutches and CVTs, your typical modern car will last an easy 300,000 miles with little to no issue. And common electronic parts for these engines are pretty cheap.