Ecky considering another Insight

[Logic]

Originally Posted by Ecky

I seem to recall Julian Edgar finding the aero better if it came out the wheel wells, but I'd need to dig through what he wrote. There is some on Ecomodder, a lot on Insight Central, and most of all on Autospeed.

Ok... Well there's also some info right in the linked paper, with pictures and graphs and all:
https://sci-hub.ru/https://www.scien...89430497000647

So I suppose my question becomes:
Is there some sort of antipathy toward research papers amongst members here and the public in general?
From previous experience that certainly seems to be the case?
If so; why..? A reading and comprehension issue??

After all, it's often the motor companies that initiate, pay for and implement successful research. Mitsubishi in this case.
A banned Julian Edgar's advice holds more weight..?
Sorry to derail the thread a bit, but I'm really scratching my head and wondering WTF about this!
It seems to me that the mental acrobatics required to discount research, served on a silver platter with pictures, sight unseen, is more mental effort than just scanning the paper!?

[freebeard]

A banned Julian Edgar's advice holds more weight..?
Sorry to derail the thread a bit, but I'm really scratching my head and wondering WTF about this!

Julian Edgar wasn't banned for being right. It was a situation similar to the BOROPower thread. He didn't take the baiting from our Usual Suspect well.

[Ecky]

Originally Posted by Logic

Ok... Well there's also some info right in the linked paper, with pictures and graphs and all:
https://sci-hub.ru/https://www.scien...89430497000647

So I suppose my question becomes:
Is there some sort of antipathy toward research papers amongst members here and the public in general?
From previous experience that certainly seems to be the case?
If so; why..? A reading and comprehension issue??

After all, it's often the motor companies that initiate, pay for and implement successful research. Mitsubishi in this case.
A banned Julian Edgar's advice holds more weight..?
Sorry to derail the thread a bit, but I'm really scratching my head and wondering WTF about this!
It seems to me that the mental acrobatics required to discount research, served on a silver platter with pictures, sight unseen, is more mental effort than just scanning the paper!?

That particular research paper discussed the difference between an air outlet in front of vs behind an engine. However, if you observe highly aerodynamic vehicles, or literally any modern vehicle, manufacturers do neither. They're all wheel well outlets. The VW XL1, for example, has an air intake under the front, and exhausts out the wheel wells. All Tesla vehicles exhaust through the wheel wells. The Mercedes A Class, which has a Cd of 0.22, exhausts through the wheel wells.

I'm not ambivalent toward academic research papers, but while the information in the paper is interesting, it's largely irrelevant, because neither option compared is generally preferable to the alternatives. I read academic articles frequently - frequently enough to know they are usually targeting something very specific, and this is not the same as a broad overview or meta analysis.

Originally Posted by freebeard

Julian Edgar wasn't banned for being right. It was a situation similar to the BOROPower thread. He didn't take the baiting from our Usual Suspect well.

Indeed. I got into it with Julian frequently. I have a lot of respect for what he does, but he generally doesn't play nicely with others.

[Logic]

Originally Posted by Ecky

That particular research paper discussed the difference between an air outlet in front of vs behind an engine. However, if you observe highly aerodynamic vehicles, or literally any modern vehicle, manufacturers do neither. They're all wheel well outlets. The VW XL1, for example, has an air intake under the front, and exhausts out the wheel wells. All Tesla vehicles exhaust through the wheel wells. The Mercedes A Class, which has a Cd of 0.22, exhausts through the wheel wells.

I'm not ambivalent toward academic research papers, but while the information in the paper is interesting, it's largely irrelevant, because neither option compared is generally preferable to the alternatives. I read academic articles frequently - frequently enough to know they are usually targeting something very specific, and this is not the same as a broad overview or meta analysis.

Ok! thx.

So that grille is the VW's inlet!? I NB its does seem to have a front inlet?
I NB the fairing on the front suspension too.


I see the Tesla even has plastic fairing doodats on the rear suspension!
https://www.reddit.com/r/TeslaModelY...plastic_metal/

[Ecky]

Now that you mention it, I'm less sure about the XL1. It's hard to find good info on it, but I believed it had a heat exchanger up front, for battery cooling, which pulled air in from the middle and vented it on the sides. However I am now unable to find anything to substantiate that. You might be right.

[Logic]

Originally Posted by Ecky

Now that you mention it, I'm less sure about the XL1. It's hard to find good info on it, but I believed it had a heat exchanger up front, for battery cooling, which pulled air in from the middle and vented it on the sides. However I am now unable to find anything to substantiate that. You might be right.

That looks like the fan is blowing downward through the radiator thats above the vents in the bottom.
That would mean; air in the front and out the vents in the 'floor'.



It's difficult to see/tell, but it does look like those vents aren't just slots.
Like some 'direct backwards' and small spoiler type lips aero work is in their design.

[Ecky]

Mocking up some battery arrangements. Looks like they'll bit fit like this:




Everything clears, though I have incentive to cut the modules down from 14S to 12S.