Go Back   EcoModder Forum > EcoModding > Hybrids
Register Now
 Register Now
 

Reply  Post New Thread
 
Submit Tools LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 03-12-2009, 05:03 PM   #21 (permalink)
EcoModding Lurker
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: St. Louis
Posts: 28

silverciv - '01 Honda Civic EX 2dr
90 day: 36.13 mpg (US)
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
It is pretty funny to me that on a site called ecoMODDER, people seem to complain that no one makes a car that is exactly what they want straight off the lot. I don't say that to sound critical of them, it just seems to me like much of this site is about buying a car and making it get better gas mileage not finding a manufacturer that can make the car we want.

I'm not sure that there is enough demand for the types of cars that many of us would want anyway. Sure we don't feel the need for power locks, power steering, power windows and fast acceleration but, most of the world does and It doesn't make sense for them to offer that kind of vehicle for such a small market.

I know that the new Insight is not the same type of vehicle that the first Insight was but, that doesn't make it less significant or a worse car. Sales numbers pretty much show that most people didn't like the first Insight (I loved it though). However, people seem to want a vehicle like the new Insight and with the Eco-Assist feature, the masses will begin to see that their vehicles can do better than the EPA estimates and see the impact of their bad driving habits. Just because it isn't the car you wanted doesn't mean is is a bad car. Just because it looks like a Prius and is a hybrid like a Prius doesn't mean it is a bad car.

__________________
  Reply With Quote
Alt Today
Popular topics

Other popular topics in this forum...

   
Old 03-12-2009, 05:38 PM   #22 (permalink)
Pokémoderator
 
cfg83's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Southern California
Posts: 5,864

1999 Saturn SW2 - '99 Saturn SW2 Wagon
Team Saturn
90 day: 40.49 mpg (US)
Thanks: 439
Thanked 528 Times in 355 Posts
jmonroe -

I pretty much agree. I bought a 2nd gen CRX brand new and that was *the* best car I ever owned, period. When the 1st gen Insight came out, I loved what Honda did, but I couldn't justify the cost because it was too small for my needs. I also didn't have the commute back then that would have made the Insight more practical for me.

CarloSW2
__________________

What's your EPA MPG? Go Here and find out!
American Solar Energy Society
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2009, 01:34 PM   #23 (permalink)
Ecomodder
 
Fr3AkAzOiD's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Raleigh, NC
Posts: 259

Cobalt XFE - '08 Chevrolet Cobalt XFE
Team Chevy
90 day: 41.1 mpg (US)

'05 Malibu V6 Tow Vehicle/Track Car - '05 Chevrolet Malibu LS V6
90 day: 23.12 mpg (US)

'08 XFE average for 2013 - '08 Chevrolet Cobalt XFE
90 day: 41.1 mpg (US)

'96 Miata Track Car - '96 Mazda Miata
90 day: 18.89 mpg (US)
Thanks: 41
Thanked 24 Times in 20 Posts
I took a test drive of the Insight yesterday, wasn't impressed.

The base model didn't have a real time tire gauge so I don't know what the pressure was at, I'll assume around 28 - 32 when I would normaly have it at 38.

Battery was at 80% charge when starting so that wasn't an issue.

It seemed to give a steady mpg instead of having good speeds and gears to drive in.
I did an loop that was about 7 or 8 miles and I did reset the counter at start and only ended up with 44 mpg, now I know adding air to the tires would kick that up to about 47mpg.

I did floor it twice to see if it had any get up and go.... It would move if you needed it but my Cobalt XFE could accelerate much faster. I'll give it another 2 mpg if I hadn't done that to put it at 49mpg.

The instant MPG readout was simply a bar from 0 - 100 mpg marked at 0, 25, 50, 75, 100 mpg marks so it was hard to tell what you were instantly getting.

Due to the regenerative braking it won't drift/glide worth snot.

Didn't like how it rode, maybe it seemed soft due to lower tire pressure and added weight of the batteries but it just seemed heavy and sloppy.

You can see out of the rear window but it's not the best view.

8yr/100,000 miles warrenty on the batteries seems a little low, especialy when it will cost you $2,000 + instalation for a replacement battery pack.

They probably could have just removed the hybrid part and swaped the 1.3 liter engine for a 1.5 or 1.6 liter (probably droping a few hundred pounds in the process) and thrown in a manual transmition and would have only lost maybe 3 - 6 mpg and it would end up costing $16,000 - $17,000 instead of $20,500.

Estimating that with practice you could get a steady 50 mpg out of the Insight with
80% highway / 20% city driving unless gas got up over $7 a gallon you would be better off just picking up a Cobalt XFE for $14,500 and get 38 mpg winter, 41 mpg all spring/summer/fall.

The $6,000 you save at the dealership is better then the few hundred in gas savings and it's probably better in the end when it comes to disposal of the vehicle.

They need to make the old style Insight with the 1.3 liter engine in the new one (97hp I believe) with a 6 speed manual and a high final gear for highway cruising.
Granted it won't have the lean burn of the old one (probably) but you would have a
50+ mpg 2 person comuter car that they would sell for $16,000 - $17,000 (I believe the old Insight sold for $20,000 - $22,000).

Hybrid systems are just too expencive for the little added mpg that it returns to be overly popular.

In the end this car won't help a ecodriver/hypermiler much as the tricks we do to get extra mpg it does automaticly, however somone like my wife who dives normaly (I did pump up her tires to get how some mpg gains) and is coming from a mid sized sedan that gets 28 mpg will easily be able to get 40 - 45 mpg with the Insight it would be worth it.

It's a little greenwashing but since the idea is popular and it pulls some socker moms out of their SUVs it will be for the better.

Though I'll still be able to laugh at them when they boast 40mpg and I tell them I get that also but paid $6,000 less for my car and my insurance is lower.

I am planning on hitting up another dealer soon, this time with a tire gauge and a route planned to see if I can get any better.
__________________
Lifetime mpg


2012 mpg

Last edited by Fr3AkAzOiD; 04-08-2009 at 01:40 PM..
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2009, 01:52 PM   #24 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
NeilBlanchard's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Maynard, MA Eaarth
Posts: 7,873

Mica Blue - '05 Scion xA RS 2.0
Team Toyota
90 day: 42.48 mpg (US)

Forest - '15 Nissan Leaf S
Team Nissan
90 day: 156.46 mpg (US)

Number 7 - '15 VW e-Golf SEL
TEAM VW AUDI Group
90 day: 155.81 mpg (US)
Thanks: 3,388
Thanked 2,883 Times in 1,812 Posts
Hi,

Thanks for the review -- did the car you drove have the CVT transmission? Did you try the Eco mode?
__________________
Sincerely, Neil

http://neilblanchard.blogspot.com/
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2009, 04:40 PM   #25 (permalink)
Ecomodder
 
Fr3AkAzOiD's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Raleigh, NC
Posts: 259

Cobalt XFE - '08 Chevrolet Cobalt XFE
Team Chevy
90 day: 41.1 mpg (US)

'05 Malibu V6 Tow Vehicle/Track Car - '05 Chevrolet Malibu LS V6
90 day: 23.12 mpg (US)

'08 XFE average for 2013 - '08 Chevrolet Cobalt XFE
90 day: 41.1 mpg (US)

'96 Miata Track Car - '96 Mazda Miata
90 day: 18.89 mpg (US)
Thanks: 41
Thanked 24 Times in 20 Posts
All Insights use the CVT automatic.

I am 90% sure I had the eco assist on, as I said I'm going to take a second go at one when I have the opertunity to see if I net any better results.

Though my opinion of it not being worth it to ecodrivers/hypermilers stands even if I go back and get 55 mpg.

I'm all for saving the planet but you can't be killing my wallet at the same time.
I'm not going to be paying $6,000 more for a car that will only save me $2,000 - $3,000 in gas over the next 150,000 miles, and thats IF I don't need to pay to have the battery pack replaced.

Though I am debating about buying a hybrid or plug in hybrid for my wife in about 3 years, will have to see what comes out as time goes on.

Driving from Raleigh, NC to Baltimore, Md she will average about 37/38 mpg but then when she is running around town doing errands she her average drops to about 25 mpg.
__________________
Lifetime mpg


2012 mpg
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2009, 04:49 PM   #26 (permalink)
EcoModding Lurker
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: St. Louis
Posts: 28

silverciv - '01 Honda Civic EX 2dr
90 day: 36.13 mpg (US)
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Many of the reviews have said that mileage in the mid 60s is easily to get if you follow the Car's hints and use the EcoAssist mode. I would be interested to see what you get on your next try.
__________________
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2009, 05:39 PM   #27 (permalink)
Hypermiler
 
PaleMelanesian's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Texas
Posts: 2,314

PaleCivic (retired) - '96 Honda Civic DX Sedan
90 day: 69.2 mpg (US)

PaleFit - '09 Honda Fit Sport
Team Honda
Wagons
90 day: 44.06 mpg (US)
Thanks: 605
Thanked 422 Times in 277 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fr3AkAzOiD View Post
They probably could have just removed the hybrid part and swaped the 1.3 liter engine for a 1.5 or 1.6 liter (probably droping a few hundred pounds in the process) and thrown in a manual transmition and would have only lost maybe 3 - 6 mpg and it would end up costing $16,000 - $17,000 instead of $20,500.
I think you just described the Fit. The back end body work is a bit different, but they're built on the same platform.
__________________



11-mile commute: 100 mpg - - - Tank: 90.2 mpg / 1191 miles
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-09-2009, 11:27 AM   #28 (permalink)
Ecomodder
 
Fr3AkAzOiD's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Raleigh, NC
Posts: 259

Cobalt XFE - '08 Chevrolet Cobalt XFE
Team Chevy
90 day: 41.1 mpg (US)

'05 Malibu V6 Tow Vehicle/Track Car - '05 Chevrolet Malibu LS V6
90 day: 23.12 mpg (US)

'08 XFE average for 2013 - '08 Chevrolet Cobalt XFE
90 day: 41.1 mpg (US)

'96 Miata Track Car - '96 Mazda Miata
90 day: 18.89 mpg (US)
Thanks: 41
Thanked 24 Times in 20 Posts
The Fit is not aero dynamic enough and I doesn't net the mpg it could with a few small changes.
I've looked at the Fit as well and can tell it's a good bit smaller on the inside.

I think some of the test loops that the car magazine guys have been runing were closed tracks (don't quote me on that though) and did not reflect real world conditions.

As I said I'd like to take a second go at one (maybe tomorow morning) already knowing what course I'm taking.
__________________
Lifetime mpg


2012 mpg
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-09-2009, 07:36 PM   #29 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
roflwaffle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Southern California
Posts: 1,490

Camryaro - '92 Toyota Camry LE V6
90 day: 31.12 mpg (US)

Red - '00 Honda Insight

Prius - '05 Toyota Prius

3 - '18 Tesla Model 3
90 day: 152.47 mpg (US)
Thanks: 349
Thanked 120 Times in 79 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fr3AkAzOiD View Post
Driving from Raleigh, NC to Baltimore, Md she will average about 37/38 mpg but then when she is running around town doing errands she her average drops to about 25 mpg.
That's exactly where a hybrid shines. If a driver does mostly city, the increase in cost pays itself off via better mileage, if they do mostly highway, the extra cost generally isn't worth the extra cash up front since there tends to be a fairly small mileage difference.
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-10-2009, 09:46 AM   #30 (permalink)
Ecomodder
 
Fr3AkAzOiD's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Raleigh, NC
Posts: 259

Cobalt XFE - '08 Chevrolet Cobalt XFE
Team Chevy
90 day: 41.1 mpg (US)

'05 Malibu V6 Tow Vehicle/Track Car - '05 Chevrolet Malibu LS V6
90 day: 23.12 mpg (US)

'08 XFE average for 2013 - '08 Chevrolet Cobalt XFE
90 day: 41.1 mpg (US)

'96 Miata Track Car - '96 Mazda Miata
90 day: 18.89 mpg (US)
Thanks: 41
Thanked 24 Times in 20 Posts
@ roflwaffle
Thats why it isn't worth it for me, I'm fine with driving a cheap work car that costs all of $14,000 and I get 38 - 42 mpg from hypermiling.

My wife on the other hand doesn't hypermile and wants something a little larger and nicer so her last car was $18,000 and the jump from that price to that of something such as the Insight is minimal and the improved mpg would be worth it.

But a lot of the 25 mpg she gets around town is wastefull such as fast food drive throughs and such.

Thing is even if I were to get her a new car we would need to keep her current one to pull my boat or box trailer around with.

NC has a per car yearly tax plus you have to consider as well as the additional car insurance for a third car.

Once her car (V6 Malibu '05) gets up to about 150k miles (90k now) I may think about it though.
Heck, since most of her traveling is short I may even consider the Volt, if GM survives that long and the bloody thing doesn't cost $30k+.

__________________
Lifetime mpg


2012 mpg
  Reply With Quote
Reply  Post New Thread


Thread Tools


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Honda Insight Concept to Debut at Paris Int. Auto Show SVOboy EcoModder Blog Discussion 32 04-17-2009 11:45 AM
New Honda Insight Already Beating Expectations SVOboy EcoModder Blog Discussion 2 02-25-2009 10:21 AM
2010 Honda Insight with Mugen Zero-Lift overclk Aerodynamics 4 02-23-2009 02:49 PM
2010 honda insight joesgot4 Hybrids 1 11-21-2008 10:35 PM
Opinions: CRX HF, Honda Insight or Keep Suzuki Swift? dunhamjr General Efficiency Discussion 17 06-18-2008 06:14 PM



Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.5.2
All content copyright EcoModder.com