2011 Green Grand Prix: Fri., April 15 (Watkins Glen, NY)

[brucepick]

+1 on Montreal - but with a full belly pan, I think my Civic might get delayed at the border crossings. "Excuse me sir, but we need to look behind those panels".

Anywhoooo,
We now have the speed rules for GGP.

Bob says: "Your average lap speed should be 45 mph." No details yet on how speeds affect your scoring so I'm taking it as a target average. I'm curious to see how close I can come to that while hypermiling the course as best I can. Cars will have transponders so potentially the officials can know your speed at each moment.

Minimum track speed: 35 mph
Maximum track speed: 55mph
Three turns have speed limits of 40 and 45 mph.

After the start/finish line the first turn is "the 90" which is 40 mph.
No speed limit through the Esses, other than the 55 overall limit.
Esses = 3 gentle curves, combined with a 38' drop then 59' climb.
The next turn is the big "Loop", limit 40 mph.
Followed by an "S" turn posted at 45 mph, as you approach the start/finish.

No passing allowed in the turns with speed limits, and also no passing within a portion of the "Esses".

I might be the only Ecomodder competing at GGP this year, I can't keep track of everyone's status any more. Say hello if you see me there. 44 entries so far. Included are a Vespa, a '75 Robin Reliant (3-wheel boxy small car), a diesel Porsche (Ecomodder??).

[moTthediesel]

Originally Posted by brucepick

I might be the only Ecomodder competing at GGP this year, I can't keep track of everyone's status any more. Say hello if you see me there. 44 entries so far. Included are a Vespa, a '75 Robin Reliant (3-wheel boxy small car), a diesel Porsche (Ecomodder??).

Yup, there will be at least one other person from this forum there, I'll be competing with my 356TD. I see there is another 356 entered too, with original gasser power.

Weather forecast sounds good, so it should be fun --

Tom

[MetroMPG]

Have fun, Bruce & Tom.

I'm sorry I can't make it to this one.

[brucepick]

Originally Posted by moTthediesel

Yup, there will be at least one other person from this forum there, I'll be competing with my 356TD. I see there is another 356 entered too, with original gasser power.

Weather forecast sounds good, so it should be fun --

Tom

I'll see you there. I gotta get my stuff together and get OUTA here! About a 6 hour drive, and I'm not packed yet. Car is prepped though.

[Gasoline Fumes]

I know I'm posting this kinda late, but I'll be stopping by.

[brucepick]

Wow - It was a real thrill to participate in the event on that course. My brother Steve drove up from NJ to navigate. We really enjoyed getting together for this.

From where I sit, moving this event to Watkins Glen International should certainly raise public recognition of fuel economy competitions.

Tom (moTthediesel), Matt (gray Insight I) and I represented EcoModder at this year's GGP. I took first in Class 2 at 57.21 mpg. Matt of course far surpassed me in mpg but in another class, I believe #5. Tom, please weigh in and let us know how it went for you.

[moTthediesel]

Originally Posted by brucepick

Wow - It was a real thrill to participate in the event on that course. My brother Steve drove up from NJ to navigate. We really enjoyed getting together for this.

From where I sit, moving this event to Watkins Glen International should certainly raise public recognition of fuel economy competitions.

I agree! I thought driving the course (After having gone there to watch events for years) was a real thrill. That grade up through the esses was much steeper when seen from the track, that's for sure!

Tom (moTthediesel), Matt (gray Insight I) and I represented EcoModder at this year's GGP. I took first in Class 2 at 57.21 mpg. Matt of course far surpassed me in mpg but in another class, I believe #5. Tom, please weigh in and let us know how it went for you.

Weigh in indeed! I actually don't know what I got for mileage because I was distracted talking to someone and didn't find out my second scale result Then I was yakking with George Voll (diesel Metro conversion) and missed most of the award ceremony too.

I emailed Bob and asked him to let me know, but I guess he's still trying to figure out the TSD results, because I haven't heard from him yet.

I really have no idea how well we did. We pulled some pretty high egt's up through the esses and the whole length of the back straight. OTOH, we were able to do good bit of EOC too, maybe 25% of the lap length, so who knows?

I suggested to Bob that they post all the results on the website, I hope they do.

[brucepick]

Originally Posted by moTthediesel

... I suggested to Bob that they post all the results on the website, I hope they do.

Good suggestion. I'll write to him and ask for that too.

As for the weigh-ins - - I talked with the Robin driver for a while. He observed them weigh the Vespa twice in succession. He reported a 2 lb difference between the two, and the weighings were not before + after.

I appreciate that it's not easy getting mpg data on a vehicle without the electronics that support an MPGuino.

[moTthediesel]

Originally Posted by brucepick

Good suggestion. I'll write to him and ask for that too.

As for the weigh-ins - - I talked with the Robin driver for a while. He observed them weight the Vespa twice in succession. he reported a 2 lb difference between the two, and the weighings were not before + after.

I appreciate that it's not easy getting mpg data on a vehicle without the electronics that support an MPGuino.

Yeah, I have my doubts about that too --

But there's not much else could be done with old school diesels like mine. Maybe I'll think about putting together a graduated test-tank like they use for fuel consumption testing in boats. Problem is, my engine compartment is so small and crowded that there would be nowhere to put it

[RobertSmalls]

I was ready to be disappointed with the 2011 GGP, with it being so pricey, so early in the season, and on a Friday. But these things were necessary in order for it to be held on the track.

It was great to be at WGI with 40 or so other economy-minded drivers. I think there were about five X-Prize cars, a few university entries, some classic cars, and two homemade streamlined diesel trikes. This was a much more interesting turnout than last year, where only street-legal cars could participate.

One of the three-wheeled diesels has a web site: Dirigo Car | Cross Country Rally Green Read more: Cross Coun... | Cars, Practical, Mileage, Group, Good

As for me, I got 87.1mpg in the Insight. However, an Insight from Alfred State scored 89.6mpg and got first place in our category. Their car was a totally gutted Insight, with an ABS grille block riveted to the hood and front bumper. They had no interior whatsoever, no passenger seat or airbag, no spare tire, no navigator, and no luggage in the car. I believe that places the Alfred State Insight at a 400-500lb advantage over mine.

They made the questionable decision of using RE92's at the rear and Insight temporary spares at the front. There's an aero and weight advantage there, but I'm not sure if the temporary tires are lower rolling resistance. As long as their FE computer accounted for the 10% difference in circumference, though, I don't mind.

Once I figured out how to drive the track, I took the same approach every lap, and consistently got around 90mpg. There wasn't much opportunity for lean burn or P&G, because the course was steep enough.

The drive over to Watkins Glen was a challenge for the Insight. I wasn't going to be able to lean burn at reasonable speeds due to the headlights and the temperatures, so I floored it and got 58mpg on the way there. On the way back, I was only slightly more patient and got 70mpg. In both directions, I encountered hills that gave my battery quite a workout. I finally met hills big enough that I have to make sure my SoC is low before I reach the crest.