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Old 12-10-2014, 03:00 PM   #71 (permalink)
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Some one needs to let this guy barrow a "25% improvement" hho cell and test it for real:
http://ecomodder.com/forum/showthrea...ect-30582.html

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Old 12-10-2014, 03:22 PM   #72 (permalink)
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That can be arranged I am quite sure.

Quote:
Originally Posted by oil pan 4 View Post
Some one needs to let this guy barrow a "25% improvement" hho cell and test it for real:
http://ecomodder.com/forum/showthrea...ect-30582.html
But throwing in the 25% expectations is not the point. Moving operating conditions around and seeing the results is.

As I have discussed in the past, the enthalpy of the fuel/air mix right before ignition is important. We cannot easily change the turbulence, but we can add fuel heat, intake heat and eventually varied amounts of seeding gas (HHO). All of this affects the chemical kinetics and can reduce the ignition lead time.

You have heavy duty EGR heat exchangers that could be effectively used as intake heat exchangers. The dyno poster, fujioko, has already built a fuel to coolant heat exchanger, and I have a robust electrolysis generator. Integrating all of this on his test engine dyno would take some effort, but, it would give our forum some definitive answers to the question of HHO.
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Old 12-11-2014, 07:51 PM   #73 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by oil pan 4 View Post
In science, if something doesn't work that is just as important as knowing if it does work.
So true so true
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Old 12-12-2014, 04:32 AM   #74 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wmjinman View Post
A ScanGuage should work on a 2000 year model.
I think that a Scan/Ultra Gauge is not an adequately accurate or applicable instrument for getting test results.

Someone correct me if I am wrong, but I understand that S/U G both derive fuel consumption information mostly from airflow data, then a some math based on engine size, sensor flow, an assumed air fuel ratio checked by O2 sensor data. Not by directly measuring fuel delivered to the engine.

Replacing some of the intake air, and burning fuel that is not on average close to gasoline is may provide a potential instrumentation errors.

Doing tank to tank gives too much noise unless the results are large.

This leaves small fuel cell, or MPGuino(or other duty cycle monitoring device) for accurate fuel metering for testing. A fuel cell works due to it's small size and the ability to accurately measure the consumption from it. MPGuino works because it is measuring the amount of time the injectors are open, and multiplying that by the rate of flow.
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Old 12-12-2014, 12:28 PM   #75 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RustyLugNut View Post
But throwing in the 25% expectations is not the point. Moving operating conditions around and seeing the results is.

As I have discussed in the past, the enthalpy of the fuel/air mix right before ignition is important. We cannot easily change the turbulence, but we can add fuel heat, intake heat and eventually varied amounts of seeding gas (HHO). All of this affects the chemical kinetics and can reduce the ignition lead time.

You have heavy duty EGR heat exchangers that could be effectively used as intake heat exchangers. The dyno poster, fujioko, has already built a fuel to coolant heat exchanger, and I have a robust electrolysis generator. Integrating all of this on his test engine dyno would take some effort, but, it would give our forum some definitive answers to the question of HHO.
The problem is heated fuel tends to now show fuel economy improvement on modern gasoline engines.
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Old 12-12-2014, 02:15 PM   #76 (permalink)
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http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j...81828268,d.aWw

I found this very interesting!!!
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Old 12-12-2014, 06:05 PM   #77 (permalink)
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Lots of graphs, few references but the graphs don't seem to be just made up.
If this all is true then it seems that small quantities of hydrogen allow for more EGR in a regular engine, making it more economical at light loads - right what we can use.

I don't think the oxygen content in oxyhydrogen would make matters worse; the fact that it compensates for the hydrogen would only make it easier to regulate the gas flow by the oxygen sensor.

Whether that is enough to overcome the cost of making hydrogen - I'd still prefer to distract it separately from the oxygen and only mix them in the intake - that remains to be seen.
It may take 10% of the engine produced power to generate 1% worth of hydrogen. That may be too much.

Bottom line is that even if it does work it still needs reprogramming of the EGR flow ratios.
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Old 12-12-2014, 08:46 PM   #78 (permalink)
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Another good read.
Green Car Congress: PSA to commercialize SwRI-developed Dedicated-EGR technology in high-efficiency gasoline engines by 2018
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Old 12-12-2014, 09:29 PM   #79 (permalink)
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The SwRI HEDGE III page: SwRI: HEDGE III, High-Efficiency Dilute Gasoline Engine Consortium

and this graph should pique somebody's interest:


Last edited by gone-ot; 12-12-2014 at 11:08 PM..
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Old 12-13-2014, 07:40 PM   #80 (permalink)
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And, here is their (SwRI) catalog of automotive-research brochures: SwRI Automotive Engineering Brochures

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