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Old 03-01-2013, 05:37 PM   #11 (permalink)
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Thanks guys,

Sorry about my impatience, Mech, but I was antsy to get the car back & wanted to have something to tell the mechanic in the morning.

In the end, I bought some 0w30 and had them use that. It says right on the bottle it's an acceptable replacement for the 5w30, which is what's written on the engine's oil fill cap. I'm thinking that we'll be going into summer soon, so that's another reason to stick with the 30 weight for this change. Then, maybe come fall, especially if I find out more to indicate it's ok, try the 0w20 over the winter.

I like MetroMPG's suggestion of getting the used oil tested. I've never done that before, so need to learn how. But I'm seeing testing the 0w30 when I drain it, then running the 0w20 over the winter & then getting that tested. Then compare the results (assuming I can even tell what the heck they mean!! LOL!!!!)

EDIT: Oh, also - it seems getting an oil pressure readout on the thing isn't going to be simple, either... The ScanGauge doesn't seem to have any provision for it, even in the customize-able "X-Gauge" menu. And according to the mechanic, there's a weird type of nut holding the "oil light" sending unit on, so it wouldn't be a simple case of plumbing in a pipe "T". That was another big reason I abandoned the 20 weight oil for this change.... not being able to monitor oil pressure was just "too much"..


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Old 03-01-2013, 06:12 PM   #12 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wmjinman View Post
Sorry for my ignorance, but what is the cSt?
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Viscosity in centistokes. Lower numbers mean thinner oil. Notice the big difference at cooler temps and the very slight difference at operating temp? Based on that, I might try the 0w-20 in my Civic, which also calls for 5w-30 like your Suzuki engine.

If you do an oil analysis, they will explain the results and make recommendations. I've never had one done myself, but I've seen other people's results online. Blackstone Labs seems to be the popular choice for analyzing oil.
http://www.blackstone-labs.com/
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Old 03-01-2013, 06:22 PM   #13 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wmjinman View Post
Oh, also - it seems getting an oil pressure readout on the thing isn't going to be simple, either... The ScanGauge doesn't seem to have any provision for it, even in the customize-able "X-Gauge" menu. And according to the mechanic, there's a weird type of nut holding the "oil light" sending unit on, so it wouldn't be a simple case of plumbing in a pipe "T". That was another big reason I abandoned the 20 weight oil for this change.... not being able to monitor oil pressure was just "too much"..
The ScanGauge wouldn't be able to get an oil pressure reading even if it was capable of it. The sending unit for the light is only a switch that turns on the oil light below 4 PSI. Unless the newer Suzuki engines changed a lot, there should be multiple oil ports on the block that can be used. And removing the factory pressure switch should be easy. I've read that tees aren't the best way to add a gauge, they can break from vibration.
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Old 03-01-2013, 07:08 PM   #14 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gasoline Fumes View Post
I posted this on your other thread, but I'll put it here too.

The 0w oils are Mobil 1 fuel economy oil and the 5w-30 is normal Mobil 1.

0w-20 @ 100°C = 8.7 cSt
0w-30 @ 100°C = 10.9 cSt
5w-30 @ 100°C = 11.0 cSt

0w-20 @ 40°C = 44.8 cSt
0w-30 @ 40°C = 62.9 cSt
5w-30 @ 40°C = 61.7 cSt
As you can see, the 40c rating is 104f and is still much thicker than it's 100c/212f viscosity. Install an oil temp gauge and find out what temp the oil gets up to. If it gets up to 100c/212f then a 30w will work well. If it only gets to 190f then a 20w 'operational viscosity' is slightly thicker than the 30w at 212f.

My cars oil temps run 185f most of the time and only got to 200f once.
This means my 20w oil has an operational viscosity of a low to mid 30w.

With the lower oil temps, you can run a thinner weight and take advantage of a thinner oil at startup, which flows faster and reduces drag.

Now, I don't know how much mpg you 'might' gain, and I say this because I normally run 5w20, but I did run 10w30 (also approved in the manual) for one oil change interval and got the best mpg with it than with any other oil.

Too much BS out there and it's good to have a place where REAL people can share experiences.
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Old 03-02-2013, 01:34 AM   #15 (permalink)
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Wow, really? You got better mileage with 10w30 than with 5w20?!?!?! That sure is counter-intuitive, huh? Were these the same brand & type oil? (synthetic, etc) And was that better mileage consistant throughout that whole time with the heavier oil? Definitely some "food for thought"!!!
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Old 03-02-2013, 08:02 AM   #16 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wmjinman View Post
Wow, really? You got better mileage with 10w30 than with 5w20?!?!?! That sure is counter-intuitive, huh? Were these the same brand & type oil? (synthetic, etc) And was that better mileage consistant throughout that whole time with the heavier oil? Definitely some "food for thought"!!!
Look at my fuel log for 'Sweetie' and it's easy to find where I ran the 10w30.

Better mpg throughout the service interval, better record mileage (+2.5 mpg),
Same brand (Pennzoil) but Pennzoil Ultra 5w20 (syn) vs PYB 10w30 (conv).

Funny thing was that the engine 'felt' a little sluggish with the 10w30 so I figured the mileage would suffer.

I've run Durablend 5w20, M1 5w20 and 10w30 (terrible), RP 5w20, PU 5w20 and PYB 10w30. Going back to PYB but might try the 5w20 just to see.

Starting to feel like all the supposed advantages of much touted synthetic oil is a farce! BITOG is a wonderful site for learning about oil.
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Old 03-02-2013, 01:24 PM   #17 (permalink)
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I buy into the cold weather viscosity as being a drag but once the engine gets up to temperature having too thin of oil may increase metal to metal contact.

I normally run 15w-40 in the summer and 5w-40 in the winter. The 15w40 is cheaper. I have tried thinner oils in my fords and never noticed any change in economy. I would rather have the increased protection of the 40 weight equivalent.

All of my driving is at least 6 miles with at least one long trip on a tank.
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Old 03-02-2013, 02:44 PM   #18 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Varn View Post
I buy into the cold weather viscosity as being a drag but once the engine gets up to temperature having too thin of oil may increase metal to metal contact.

I normally run 15w-40 in the summer and 5w-40 in the winter. The 15w40 is cheaper. I have tried thinner oils in my fords and never noticed any change in economy. I would rather have the increased protection of the 40 weight equivalent.

All of my driving is at least 6 miles with at least one long trip on a tank.

BUT, thicker oil runs hotter than thin oil, which means you loose most of the supposed 'protection' benefit a thicker oil might give because it runs hotter, which means thinner.

A 40 is thicker than a 20 at all similar temps, but if 20 runs cooler by about 25-30f, then the viscosity and protection will be very much the same.
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Old 03-02-2013, 03:20 PM   #19 (permalink)
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Harvey
I don't have an oil temp gauge to verify that the oil is running hotter with the 15w40. If it were, would that mean that the oil would be transferring more heat away from the bearings and cylinder walls?

Have you collected oil temperature data showing that you car runs hotter with heavier oil? I am sure you have a source of your data.

The ultragauge shows the same coolant temp. 192-198°F no matter what oil I have used. When I have run garage installed oil it has been 5w20. It turns dark pretty quickly and the engine seems to use a quart per 1000 miles. I don't notice the consumption when running either Rotella or MFA 15w40.
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Old 03-02-2013, 03:34 PM   #20 (permalink)
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Harvey
I don't have an oil temp gauge to verify that the oil is running hotter with the 15w40. If it were, would that mean that the oil would be transferring more heat away from the bearings and cylinder walls?

Have you collected oil temperature data showing that you car runs hotter with heavier oil? I am sure you have a source of your data.

The ultragauge shows the same coolant temp. 192-198°F no matter what oil I have used. When I have run garage installed oil it has been 5w20. It turns dark pretty quickly and the engine seems to use a quart per 1000 miles. I don't notice the consumption when running either Rotella or MFA 15w40.

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