Cameras are a success in Quebec (for speeding & red lights)

[Whoops]

Well I am strongly opposed to the use of the camera's. Here in Ventura, a camera ticked costs $350, but if it was a legitimate ticket, it would normally be $50.

These rascals can be fought and won, but it is a pain, particularly when legally the yellow light should have been almost twice as long. The ticket I fought, I started checking the timing of the yellow lights and every last one of the intersections with cameras were set to the minimum legally recognized limit, for a 25 mph speed zone. The problem is that none of the lights are on streets with 25 mph speeds.

Every light intersection without a camera had the yellow intervals set to times which corresponded to a safe stopping interval, based on the speed limit which was posted for the street.

The problem is that the cameras are managed by city bureaucrats who are highly tempted to fudge things, simply in order to generate additional revenue for the city. Until someone can figure out a way to manage the bureaucrats, they will just continue to abuse the average citizen, not because it's right, but because they can, in my opinion.

[dcb]

Yah, lets mount web cams on the beurocrats

[RH77]

Originally Posted by dcb

Yah, lets mount web cams on the beurocrats

Now you're talkin! Wait, I think it's called C-SPAN

The problem is the apathy of the "Can't Fight City Hall" attitude that most of the public has. We have more impact on local issues than we realize. It's easier to complain without a solution (I'm quite guilty of it, to be honest).

I challenge visits to City Council meetings or personal calls to council members. Like Darin said, it worked up North. Our employees can't get re-hired with a bad review

The same goes for State and Federal officials, FWIW...

RH77

[roflwaffle]

Originally Posted by Luxbg

I'll throw in my five cents:

Red light cameras suck. Period. Numerous studies have shown that they increase the accident rates at the monitored intersections because people slam on the brakes like crazy. (I don't have any links on hand but I can dig them up if so desired.)

IIRC the same study also said that even though accident rates increased, more fender benders, fatality rates decreased due to fewer t-bones. Seemed like a good trade-off from the POV of the driving safety.

[Frank Lee]

Microchip implants and 24/7 real time tracking of every citizen might mean the end of missing persons too. Good from the POV of concerned families.

[roflwaffle]

And concerned families can go ahead w/ that if they wanna. The point of red light cameras is that it reduces public domain fatalities in a fashion acceptable to the society as a whole. Tracking citizens movements 24/7 isn't public domain unless the citizens are in the public domain 24/7, and it's probably not acceptable to society as a whole based on what I've seen. Apples and orangutans.

[tasdrouille]

There seems to be a common line of thouht with everyone not liking those cameras. They feel it's unfair that people are tricked into getting a ticket. I think that's not a problem with the concept of cameras per se, but the way it was implemented.

[MazdaMatt]

Sounds like a like of *****ing and moaning to me. Stop speeding, stopping running lights and you won't get a ticket. Don't give me this "implanting chips" crap - that's a stretch to say the least... you're being rediculous.

If I know there's a camera and i stop quickly and someone rams me, well he gets a ticket for following too closely as he should. Don't give him the excuse of "that guy stopped only because of the camera"... no... you stop for the light. You run the light due to lack of camera.

I would LOOOOVE it if all the light-controlled intersections in this town would have cameras set up. I'm sick of watching my advanced green go away because the people in cross traffic are not done running their red light yet, 4, 5, 6 cars at a time. EVERY DAY, EVERY INTERSECTION down the major streets of London (Ontario).

I also want EVERY overpass on the major highways here to have speeding cameras over each lane.

People do stupid things like rear-ending stoppers because they are used to breaking the law. Make them used to following the law and the problem goes away.

Quit your *****ing, nobody is going to tie a shock collar on your neck and install a camera in your bedroom - you read too many books from the paranoid cold war era.

[Luxbg]

Originally Posted by roflwaffle

IIRC the same study also said that even though accident rates increased, more fender benders, fatality rates decreased due to fewer t-bones. Seemed like a good trade-off from the POV of the driving safety.

Yes now that you mention that, it rings a bell. However it is generally the one running the red light getting T-boned, so I say good riddance

Originally Posted by MazdaMatt

I would LOOOOVE it if all the light-controlled intersections in this town would have cameras set up. I'm sick of watching my advanced green go away because the people in cross traffic are not done running their red light yet, 4, 5, 6 cars at a time. EVERY DAY, EVERY INTERSECTION down the major streets of London (Ontario).

Until the city starts doing what so many cities do and shortens the yellow phase to increase their profits. Many cities have been caught doing this, with some shortening the amount of yellow time so much so to make it almost impossible to reasonably stop (even at the speed limit). For a few examples see here: 6 cities that have been caught shortening yellow times

For a nice list of arguments against the use of cameras, have a look at: http://www.motorists.org/photoenforce/

[MazdaMatt]

"don't give the city red light camera because they might shorten the yellows" is like saying "don't give police guns because they might shoot the innocent people". Yeah, it happens but you can't argue the positive effects. Don't bash the cameras, bash the cities that screw their people.