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Old 11-28-2015, 01:17 PM   #11 (permalink)
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Benefits vs how the Insight is set up now:

Allows electric-only driving


Downsides:

No stop/start, or would need a second electric motor

No dampening of engine vibration (Insight electric motor pulses harmonically to cancel out the vibrations of the 3 cylinder engine)

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Old 11-28-2015, 03:42 PM   #12 (permalink)
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Could you put a Gen1 Insight drive train into a Gen 2?
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Old 11-28-2015, 05:22 PM   #13 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Xist View Post
Could you put a Gen1 Insight drive train into a Gen 2?
I suspect the little 3 cylinder wouldn't have enough power to maintain highway speeds in 5th gear, and you'd end up driving around in 4th at higher RPM. It probably wouldn't deliver much, if any better MPG.
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Old 11-28-2015, 05:56 PM   #14 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ecky View Post
Benefits vs how the Insight is set up now:

Allows electric-only driving


Downsides:

No stop/start, or would need a second electric motor

No dampening of engine vibration (Insight electric motor pulses harmonically to cancel out the vibrations of the 3 cylinder engine)

Extra width
I have to admit I disagree with the engine vibration cancel idea. I have driven so, so many insights that have the IMA completely bypassed, and even a car with an alternator that had the ENTIRE IMA system removed except the electric motor and they all feel the same as cars with IMA.
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Old 11-28-2015, 06:13 PM   #15 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ecky View Post
Benefits vs how the Insight is set up now:

Allows electric-only driving
I wish you'd explain why you think this would be a benefit, when you have only a relatively small battery. You could only go a mile or two on electric, and doing so would add many charge/discharge cycles. Seems far better to simply use the IMA system as designed. (With of course the addition of MIMA.)
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Old 11-28-2015, 07:38 PM   #16 (permalink)
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Turbo Gen1 Insight?
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Old 11-28-2015, 09:40 PM   #17 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Baltothewolf View Post
I have to admit I disagree with the engine vibration cancel idea. I have driven so, so many insights that have the IMA completely bypassed, and even a car with an alternator that had the ENTIRE IMA system removed except the electric motor and they all feel the same as cars with IMA.
IMA Motor and Engine Vibration - Insight Central: Honda Insight Forum

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hybrid-Battery-Repair View Post
If you have a MIMA, you can see it pulsing at idle. The gauges, as usual, lie to you and hide it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Dabrowski 2000 View Post
As I see it,
The crank position sensor lets the ECM know where the crank is at all times. The IMA motor is always in the same relative position to the crank, as it is a synchronous motor.

The vibration is predictable within the revolution, and the vibration continues every rotation, so it is not a random event.

The crank position sensor lets the system know the rotational position, but also by measuring the time between crank position sensor pulses, vibration amplitude can be derived.
The system fires the IMA regen or assist pulse and looks for a more consistent flywheel speed as feedback to determine the IMA pulse amplitude that smooths the vibration best.

A look at the current sensor signal with a scope at idle will show the pulses clearly. Once the RPM gets over 1500rpm, the flywheel can damp the vibrations without help, so the amplitude of the balancing pulses decreases and eventually stops as rpm increases.

If the AC is on at idle, the pulses need to be bigger to damp vibrations as the AC load is trying to slow the flywheel down, and less energy is stored between power pulses, therefore more crank position sensor speed variations are seen, so more damping is applied until the speed variations are minimized.
The MIMA current sensor measurement is done frequently enough to catch the rapidly pulsing current and it shows it as alternating assist and regen flashing LEDS.
The Insight has a balanced crankshaft and flywheel, unlike most other inline 3 engines.


Quote:
Originally Posted by jamesqf View Post
I wish you'd explain why you think this would be a benefit, when you have only a relatively small battery. You could only go a mile or two on electric, and doing so would add many charge/discharge cycles. Seems far better to simply use the IMA system as designed. (With of course the addition of MIMA.)
I'd argue that it could be a tool for hypermilers, but it's completely understandable why Honda didn't do this. They did, however, enable EV-only mode on the Gen2 HCH. Rather than moving the IMA motor, they engineered in a system to shut all of the valves in the engine and let the IMA drag it along down the road. Why, I couldn't say. Maybe so they had feature parity with the Prius?
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Old 11-28-2015, 10:22 PM   #18 (permalink)
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It won't work with an Insight but on FWD cars that had 4 wheel drive options and on the fly engagement, you could drive the front wheels through the rear 4wd portion of the transmission and have the same ratio as the final drive of the rear differential, about 3.5 to 1. Clearance would already exist for the 4wd option.

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mech
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Old 11-29-2015, 02:15 AM   #19 (permalink)
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any AWD/4wd auto could be used.

or better just convert the auto to fwd and mount the electric drive to the rear with a magnetic clutch


first one to come to mind is Subaru Justy, granted there gearing may be a real issue...but they have a push butten for 4wd engage on the shiftier.

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