01-18-2017, 02:28 AM
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#51 (permalink)
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Master EcoModder
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Take some aspirin before reading
You can dual-core the IC as well...
Or even 2 stage with standard IC primary (reduced size) and a temperature controlled water to air secondary like this .
Quote:
Description
This is an enormous water to air intercooler.
The proportions are somewhat ridiculous, please make sure it will fit before ordering. If you have the room, there's nothing better.
The height, its smallest dimension, is nine inches. This intercooler is more than five times larger than our smallest core. Recommended for up to two thousand horsepower.
100% Lightweight aluminum, No Epoxy Used In Core
Fin pitch is 21 fins/inch - 12.5 air side and 8.5 water side.
Recommended for up to 2500 CFM / 2000 HP
Pressure Drop: Less than 0.5 PSI. This is not a typo! Liquid/Air Intercoolers have incredibly low pressure drop.
Inlet: 4" Outlet: 4"
Maximum water/air pressure: 70 PSI
Core Size: 9.5"x9"x9" (Endtanks add to length)
From:allpurposepipes.com
Water to Air intercoolers
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I have been looking at theas
They appear to have the capacity to build any custom setup you may desire. Tie into the block (like the heater core)to aid in cold weather conditions by maintaining higher IAT +20°f . Warm up time reduction. (times required to rach high efficiency)by feeding warm/ hot air into the intake. And a supplemental radiator to keep IAT low enough.
Call a Cummins "Applications Engineer Technician " to get a specific temperature window recommendation for there ISX with your specific build and planned computer reprogramming.
With the volume of engines you are buying and retrofitting they may even send a tech to modify there engine to fit your needs.
__________________
1st gen cummins 91.5 dodge d250 ,HX35W/12/6 QSV
ehxsost manafulld wrap, Aero Tonto
best tank: distance 649gps mi 24.04 mpg 27.011usg
Best mpg : 31.32mpg 100mi 3.193 USG 5/2/20
Former
'83 GMC S-15 Jimmy 2door 2wd O/D auto 3.73R&P
'79 Chevy K20 4X4 350ci 400hp msd custom th400 /np205. 7.5-new 14mpg modded befor modding was a thing
87' Hyundai Excel
83 ranger w/87 2.9 L FI2wd auto 18mpg on the floor
04 Mitsubishi Gallant 2.4L auto 26mpg
06 Subaru Forrester XT(WRX PACKAGE) MT AWD Turbocharged 18 plying dirty best of 26mpg@70mph
95Chevy Blazer 4x4 auto 14-18mpg
04 Chevy Blazer 4x4 auto 16-22mpg
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Today
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Other popular topics in this forum...
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01-18-2017, 02:49 AM
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#52 (permalink)
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EcoModding Lurker
Join Date: Jan 2017
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The W2A coolers work exceptionally well if the turbo is only being used sporadically..I had one on a 13B rotary, and it ran exceptionally cool..however, the duty cycle on a turbo on a road based car, is completely different to a turbo on a diesel truck...the truck turbo basically pumps continually at highway speeds, meaning in a short period the water reservoir will be overwhelmed, and the supplemental radiator to cool it with will not keep up with duty cycles generally higher than around 60%..
They also introduce a lot of complexity, which is something I am trying to stay away from..
Long distance haulage is a different ball game to standard road vehicles, in that reliability is the NUMBER 1 requirement...fuel economy plays a distant second, and performance a very distant 3rd..
In Australia, we have no need for reducing warm up times...think Arizona / Texas weather only...
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01-18-2017, 01:22 PM
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#53 (permalink)
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Master EcoModder
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Would it be possible to use a 'thin' fan on the crankshaft, and a secondary electric fan ahead of the radiator pushing air in?
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01-18-2017, 10:20 PM
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#54 (permalink)
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EcoModding Lurker
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Without phasing the push / pull fans, you can actually end up with LOWER airflow than a single fan..
I also dont have much room in front of the radiator as it is mounted right near the front of the truck chassis..
I figure if a OEM mechanically driven fan is pulling 8000-10,000CFM through a 90mm (3 inch) core on a truck..fully ducted..I need at least 1.5 times that CFM for a 180mm core (6 inchs of core!)
The only fans I can find that meet that are the Horton units...and being able to direct drive from the crank, and avoid frictional losses through a belt driven oem fan, I should also gain a small amount in savings on that
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01-29-2017, 09:11 PM
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#55 (permalink)
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EcoModding Lurker
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Now all I need is to find a photoshop genius that wants to create a mock up photo for me of a aero modified bonnet for conceptual purposes!!
I am struggling along with freeware GIMP..but I am far from a graphics artist lol
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01-30-2017, 02:30 AM
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#56 (permalink)
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Master EcoModder
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The GIMP is open source and all, but I eventually settled on a 2nd-hand copy of Photoshop from the Goodwill Computer Store for $2-4.00.
This mock-up — who is the audience? Blown up to poster size for a room full of people? 4000x6000 pixels?
Here is the method I use:
- the photo
- cut and shut in Photoshop
- a tracing on thin paper laid over a printout, scanned back in
- A final beauty pass in Photoshop
The next step could have details bleed through from a lower layer
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01-30-2017, 01:43 PM
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#57 (permalink)
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Not Doug
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I think the nearest Goodwill Computer Store to me is Santa Ana California. I am not even looking up how far that is. Then two in Texas, and the others I found are even further away.
There is also a Goodwill Retail!
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01-30-2017, 02:14 PM
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#58 (permalink)
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Master EcoModder
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I didn't even know they had other computer stores. The one in Bluegene appeared as competition to Nextstep Recycling. I worked for Nextstep for maybe eight years.
There are independent recycling efforts in Potland and Seattle, but I don't recall their names. There're probably some in AZ, probably mostly about hardware but with a small software selection.
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01-31-2017, 08:55 PM
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#59 (permalink)
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Banned
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A simple answer is to look at what major US fleets are doing. The one I just joined has 14,000 tractors. Latest ones use Flow Below on tractor (aero Freightliner Cascadia Evolution). Trailers have only skirts. 53' van.
Engine is 15L Detroit turned down. 62-mph limiter. 10-speed (which hurts economy). But I average 7+ mpg no matter the load. East of Mississippi River. Bunk heater. No extended indie between 32F and 65F.
Flow Vroiw us reckoned at 2.3% fleet savings per recent industry article.
USX runs only automated manual transmissions. That, and control of idle hours is probably biggest savings (given speed limiter and eiectronic logging). National truck speed limit will force buying more trucks and hiring more drivers. But will bring operational economy into sharper focus.
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02-01-2017, 07:59 PM
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#60 (permalink)
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EcoModding Lurker
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The Flow below looks to be simple aero aids around the rear wheels on the tractor..
I am looking to put a higher level of aero..roughly similar to whats on the bullet truck. However it will be designed in such a fashion to allow the aero to "tilt" upwards to allow easy access to changing wheels..
I am also partway through a hood redesign..looks like the hood line can be turned into a fairly massive slope if the radiator is redesigned. Keeping the "front" of the truck looking like a Kenworth T680 , but with the radiator grill being around 2" LOWER than the top of the fenders...instead of on the T680 it is around 2" higher.. should make a significant difference. Will require a dual pass radiator and new fan design..changing from a 1.4m h x 1.25m w x .09m d radiator to approx 0.8m h x 1.5m w x 0.13m d radiator in dual pass.
Replacing mirrors on the old units, with more aero models (Probably from a modern kenworth), removing exhaust stacks and venting below the truck, full side skirts of the truck over the tanks (Using existing steps with simple brush curtains to allow easy ingress (Similar to brushes inside wheel arches), aero mudflaps, modern bumper design, removal of external air intakes, removal of sun visor (Replace with window tint on top edge!), removal of external air horns on roofline, changing running lights to more aerodynamic LEDs, full side skirts on trailers, and vortex generators on tractor and trailer, and wheel / axle alignments (already happening)
Combined with Water Injection, Plazma reformation Hydrogen generation and injection (Look it up kiddies and be amazed...), and some engine tuning..not to forget the driver monitoring and re-education (We are installing telemetry to monitor carefully, advising of overspeed and also harsh driving (braking / acceleration / cornering etc). We will also be introducing a "carrot" to the drivers to reward the top drivers on a monthly basis..and conversely..discover the horrid drivers and quietly "re-educate them"
Hopefully it will take our trucks on our roads (600HP towing B-Double trailers with a LOT of weight, on Aussie roads which I am afraid are not as nice as that mirror smooth blacktop you guys get!) from 2kms/litre (~5mpg) --> around 5kms/litre - 12mpg..
Simple maths on the above if it can be achieved..
$1.10 per litre for diesel here atm..
250,000kms per year on a truck..
= $137500 per year just on fuel..currently
compared to $55,000 per year on fuel if it works out...per truck..saving $87,500 per year..
If the above list of works costs me $50,000 to setup per truck (I estimate closer to $35000), we are looking at 6.5 months payback...
This has not taken into account the other savings we would also obtain..such as -
Reduced oil consumption / change required (Engines running cooler with less drag / WI and Hydrogen both reduce PM , so less contamination)
Reduced servicing costs.
Reduced tyre wear (Crosswind effect reduced so less scrubbing)
reduced emissions (Not a financial impact..but still to be considered)
Advertising - if you have a super green fleet, you get more business..
longer engine life (Less stress, less contamination internally, far less carbon buildup)
Looking at it more pessimistically..
Even if I can only net a 25% improvement..going from 2km/litre to 2.5km/litre..(Which should be a walk in the park) it will still save $27,500 per year on fuel alone..which will give me a payback of 1.5 years approx..and a lot of the tech will be transferable to the next truck at end of life..
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