Go Back   EcoModder Forum > EcoModding > Aerodynamics
Register Now
 Register Now
 

Reply  Post New Thread
 
Submit Tools LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 06-23-2021, 06:57 PM   #591 (permalink)
EcoModding Apprentice
 
Bicycle Bob's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: N. Saskatchewan, CA
Posts: 1,805

Appliance White - '93 Geo Metro 4-Dr. Auto
Last 3: 42.35 mpg (US)

Stealth RV - '91 Chevy Sprint Base
Thanks: 91
Thanked 460 Times in 328 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by tomi_k View Post
the shape will be 3D surface, for sure, just need to keep in mind also how to ensure that the cap door will be usable / practical and ergonomic... and finally the cap door needs to be "waterproof"....

So initial framing is just to make the same for the final product, final product is targeted to be glass fiber cap as "classical" caps are....
Fiberglass lends itself to different shapes than plywood. There is no graceful way to get from one to the other.

__________________
There is no excuse for a land vehicle to weigh more than its average payload.
  Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Bicycle Bob For This Useful Post:
tomi_k (06-23-2021)
Alt Today
Popular topics

Other popular topics in this forum...

   
Old 06-23-2021, 07:28 PM   #592 (permalink)
Banned
 
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: Australia
Posts: 2,060
Thanks: 107
Thanked 1,605 Times in 1,136 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bicycle Bob View Post
Fiberglass lends itself to different shapes than plywood. There is no graceful way to get from one to the other.
Yes - I suggest that you just do mock-ups to test first, without worrying too much about 'getting things right' (eg the underlying framework) for the final one.

If you expect to have to try 4-5 different iterations, then you won't lock yourself into something that may well not be so good.

I'd probably start with bent steel tube (cheapest small diameter I can find) as the frame, and use tape and plastic corrugated board as the outer cover.

Last edited by JulianEdgar; 06-23-2021 at 07:42 PM.. Reason: typo
  Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to JulianEdgar For This Useful Post:
tomi_k (06-23-2021)
Old 06-23-2021, 09:01 PM   #593 (permalink)
EcoModding Lurker
 
Join Date: Jan 2021
Location: Ontario, Canada
Posts: 68
Thanks: 54
Thanked 50 Times in 35 Posts
Visit in local HomeDepot... corrugated plastic sheet is more expensive than similar thickness plywood... pros and cons on both options.... leaning towards plywood + foam...

Also tried to bend 5mm plywood... its nothing... bends what need to be done would be fine to make with that.... considering length of the cap vs. transitions needed... it would be probably fairly easy to "bend" that plywood... hence leaning towards that....

Last edited by tomi_k; 06-23-2021 at 09:21 PM..
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-23-2021, 09:17 PM   #594 (permalink)
EcoModding Lurker
 
Join Date: Jan 2021
Location: Ontario, Canada
Posts: 68
Thanks: 54
Thanked 50 Times in 35 Posts
IMG_02 : Has "straight but curved" sidewalls, 3D curved top surface
IMG_03 : Has 3D curved side and top surfaces -> towards teardrop shape -> top surface is matching to the cabin's top roof surface and extrapolated to the length of the cap. Side surfaces will taper gradually towards end of the cap forming teardrop shape yet still blends into the tail (in height) -> no increase on tail section...

Framing under is just to give a base for the plywood (simple shape)... foam on top of the plywood makes finer shapes...

Last edited by tomi_k; 07-11-2021 at 07:05 PM..
  Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to tomi_k For This Useful Post:
California98Civic (06-24-2021)
Old 06-23-2021, 09:50 PM   #595 (permalink)
EcoModding Apprentice
 
Bicycle Bob's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: N. Saskatchewan, CA
Posts: 1,805

Appliance White - '93 Geo Metro 4-Dr. Auto
Last 3: 42.35 mpg (US)

Stealth RV - '91 Chevy Sprint Base
Thanks: 91
Thanked 460 Times in 328 Posts
Basically, you are developing a buck to pull a fiberglass mold from. You can make it from any kind of garbage that can be polished and is strong enough to support wax, wet cloth, and a paint brush.
If you are planning on a single skin construction, and don't want any of the usual grooves, steps, or ridges to add stiffness, you can make a separate molding to produce an internal support, just like you find on a hood or trunk lid.
The "right" material is the one you most enjoy working with, provided it can make a suitable shape. I've done a lot of detail work using wall patching compound, and then hardened its surface for polishing with Polyvinyl Alcohol, a release agent no gentleman's molding shop should be without. Shellac also works. Final polishing can be done on the mold surface itself.
Material choice is important. Ten percent of the homebuilt aircraft that are begun are finished by the first builder, ten percent by the second builder, and ten more by the third builder, who gives up on 70% of them. You have to enjoy the work, not just the vision.
__________________
There is no excuse for a land vehicle to weigh more than its average payload.
  Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Bicycle Bob For This Useful Post:
tomi_k (06-24-2021)
Old 06-24-2021, 05:02 AM   #596 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
freebeard's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: northwest of normal
Posts: 28,488
Thanks: 8,058
Thanked 8,858 Times in 7,312 Posts


I'd never find it again, but there was a SEMA Mustang show car in a video that had a hood that four-bars backward to over the windshield. That would work well in reverse for your situation.
__________________
.
.
Without freedom of speech we wouldn't know who all the idiots are. -- anonymous poster

____________________
.
.
Three conspiracy theorists walk into a bar --You can't say that is a coincidence.
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-25-2021, 06:28 PM   #597 (permalink)
EcoModding Lurker
 
Join Date: Jan 2021
Location: Ontario, Canada
Posts: 68
Thanks: 54
Thanked 50 Times in 35 Posts
trialing how to make twisted surfaces but still missing "teardrop" tapering (looked from top)... but got an idea how to make it because of this....

https://ecomodder.com/forum/member-t...-211524-01.jpg
  Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to tomi_k For This Useful Post:
JulianEdgar (06-25-2021)
Old 06-25-2021, 06:38 PM   #598 (permalink)
EcoModding Lurker
 
Join Date: Jan 2021
Location: Ontario, Canada
Posts: 68
Thanks: 54
Thanked 50 Times in 35 Posts
Something like this... but will need to check how contours of the truck goes and do some estimations of how much "curvature" could be....

Blending all surfaces nicely to the back of the bed (not increasing wake area) and keep transitions of surfaces following closely to the truck's overall shape is the target.... Once that is established, then tweaking surfaces here and there is much easier... taking baby steps while learning....

https://ecomodder.com/forum/member-t...-211524-02.jpg

Last edited by tomi_k; 07-11-2021 at 07:09 PM..
  Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to tomi_k For This Useful Post:
aerohead (06-25-2021)
Old 06-25-2021, 06:55 PM   #599 (permalink)
Banned
 
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: Australia
Posts: 2,060
Thanks: 107
Thanked 1,605 Times in 1,136 Posts
Don't forget that if you extend the top edge of the shape past the tailgate you can then add a spoiler without increasing wake area. That is then likely to reduce drag and lift.

Also, you don't necessarily want a beautifully curved surface from the top to the sides, because this will encourage flow around this corner and so likely increase the strength of trailing vortices. The Tesla Model S has low vortex formation off the rear pillars - note their shape.

  Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to JulianEdgar For This Useful Post:
tomi_k (06-25-2021)
Old 06-25-2021, 07:12 PM   #600 (permalink)
EcoModding Lurker
 
Join Date: Jan 2021
Location: Ontario, Canada
Posts: 68
Thanks: 54
Thanked 50 Times in 35 Posts
Thanks for insights, JulianEdgar - appreciated! The idea on that top edge (between side and top surface) rounding is something like that on the Tesla... nothing drastic...

If the edge is top edge is left too "sharp" and as the top surface drops down anyways, air on side wall travels straight (looked from side) while on the top air follows the top surface with higher speed... which creates pressure differential and air movement start to go "up" on side surfaces and over the edge... if I have understood correctly.... Thats what I try to "avoid"...

Example on the Aerolid.... (and copyrights belongs to the Aerolid)...

Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	Aerolid_Sculptair_01.jpg
Views:	56
Size:	25.1 KB
ID:	30932  
  Reply With Quote
Reply  Post New Thread




Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Easy Aero Fix? (Modding a pickup?) DifferentPointofView Aerodynamics 53 04-13-2012 06:46 PM
SAE report: Pickup Truck tailgate aerodynamics... better up, down, or off? MetroMPG Aerodynamics 5 11-17-2011 03:35 PM
Sources of Aerodynamic Drag in Automobiles and Possible Solutions SVOboy Aerodynamics 12 02-17-2010 03:09 PM
How much do y'all pay for trash pickup? roflwaffle Saving@Home 15 08-23-2009 11:46 AM
Daihatsu Mira aerodynamic modifications newtonsfirstlaw Aerodynamics 5 06-13-2009 10:43 PM



Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.5.2
All content copyright EcoModder.com