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Old 10-13-2012, 01:23 PM   #31 (permalink)
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Why the gov't thinks it needs to give extra incentive to do things that already have wonderful incentives is beyond me. Perhaps I lack sufficient Edgeukation.
I'd think it's everyone else who needs it... So many people driving solo in big, guzzly cars. If a carpool lane actually goes faster than the rest of the highway, that means there's a massive underutilization of vehicular pasenger capacity sitting there in traffic, with the gasoline-driven AC cooling millions of cubic feet of unoccupied cabin...

Imagine how many football stadiums we could air-condition with that gasoline, instead!

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Old 10-13-2012, 09:54 PM   #32 (permalink)
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If concern for the environment and conservation of resources were the primary purpose of the HOV lanes, then the Cadillac Escalades, Ford Excursions, Hummers, tanks, etc would all get priority access so they can get off the highway as quickly as possible. A Prius can sit in stop and go traffic all day long without burning much, if any fuel. I don't know what the fuel consumption rate of an idling Hummer is, but it can't be good. Certainly a Prius consumes less energy in stop and go traffic than an Excursion.
The allowance of hybrids into the HOV lanes was supposed to be a favorable argument for a full-size SUV owner to get a Prius, or any other hybrid (including a Tahoe ), for daily commuting.


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Why the gov't thinks it needs to give extra incentive to do things that already have wonderful incentives is beyond me.
Many people still consider the first-term cost as the most decisive factor while buying a vehicle, not willing to pay so much more for something that is expected to pay itself in a middle to long term. It happened the same way even with the Brazilian ethanol program during the oil crisis...
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Old 10-14-2012, 02:48 AM   #33 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by niky View Post
I'd think it's everyone else who needs it... So many people driving solo in big, guzzly cars. If a carpool lane actually goes faster than the rest of the highway, that means there's a massive underutilization of vehicular pasenger capacity sitting there in traffic, with the gasoline-driven AC cooling millions of cubic feet of unoccupied cabin.
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Originally Posted by cRiPpLe_rOoStEr View Post
The allowance of hybrids into the HOV lanes was supposed to be a favorable argument for a full-size SUV owner to get a Prius, or any other hybrid (including a Tahoe ), for daily commuting.

Many people still consider the first-term cost as the most decisive factor while buying a vehicle, not willing to pay so much more for something that is expected to pay itself in a middle to long term. It happened the same way even with the Brazilian ethanol program during the oil crisis...
This emphasizes my facetious point that HOV lanes should be utilized by gas-guzzlers, and my real point that HOV lanes in general are a bad idea. People find loopholes, private interests make millions of dollars, and no net good is done for the environment or for conservation of resources.

Consider this; you have already paid for the HOV lanes through the use of taxes collected at the fuel pump, but you are denied the right to utilize the infrastructure because you don't meet an arbitrary and changing criteria.

Artificially incentivizing behavior and markets have almost without exception been shown to be pointless at best, and disastrous at worst. The government trying to artificially encourage home ownership was the cause of the U.S. housing collapse and financial meltdown.

The reason behind all of this: politicians want to give "things" to irresponsible people at the tax payers expense to gain votes.
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Old 10-14-2012, 05:28 AM   #34 (permalink)
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The problem is not home ownership per se, but that various presidents have lowered the bar over the years for those home loans to the pojnt where any idiot could get one.

Part of the Singapore miracle was providing housing to the working and middle class, but they were very strict about it.

But yeah, HOV lanes... Frugality should be its own reward... Unfortunately, some people wouldn't know frugality if it hit them in the face...
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Old 10-14-2012, 06:16 AM   #35 (permalink)
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Unfortunately, some people wouldn't know frugality if it hit them in the face...
I'm going to change my name to Frugality.
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Old 10-14-2012, 06:34 AM   #36 (permalink)
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I'm going to change my name to Frugality.
Good way to avoid assault charges during road rage...
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Old 10-15-2012, 12:14 AM   #37 (permalink)
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I'm going to change my name to Frugality.
Wouldn't that be redundant?

You should have frugality change it's name to Frank Lee.
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Old 10-18-2012, 10:52 PM   #38 (permalink)
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Artificially incentivizing behavior and markets have almost without exception been shown to be pointless at best, and disastrous at worst.
There were other options which could also have good results in matter of fuel-efficiency/environmental performance (namely light Diesels), but EPA goes deliberately against them. Sure, there are some cultural barriers, but are not so hard to overcome...
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Old 10-19-2012, 04:38 AM   #39 (permalink)
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There were other options which could also have good results in matter of fuel-efficiency/environmental performance (namely light Diesels), but EPA goes deliberately against them. Sure, there are some cultural barriers, but are not so hard to overcome...
It frustrates me that CARB has such an influence on the auto industry, in particular with respect to light diesel. I have been holding my breath for ages for a company to release a reliable, small to midsize sedan with a turbo diesel engine (VW does not meet my reliability criteria).

My dream would be to own a turbo diesel Toyota Tacoma. I could then start building these neat aerocaps and have a 40mpg do-it-all, go anywhere vehicle.

I'm not sure what you mean by cultural barriers. If by cultural, you mean having the steering wheel on the wrong side of the car, then I'm not willing to compromise
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Old 10-19-2012, 11:47 PM   #40 (permalink)
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I'm not sure what you mean by cultural barriers. If by cultural, you mean having the steering wheel on the wrong side of the car, then I'm not willing to compromise
Some people still think Diesels are dirt, or not so reliable due to the the failures from Oldsmobile Diesels.

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