The danger of saving energy

[stovie]

I kind of feel like the city should offer a setup like some of these solar companies are!! If they can get you paying around 100-200 a month for 30 years they don't have to worry about the grid really at all, and about 10 years into it their basically just making profit!! So that way they have 20 years to prepare for eliminating the grid altogether!!!

[Erasmo]

Why would you want to eliminate the grid? Make it smarter instead!

For example a company here in the Netherlands is now offering 450 euro per year if they can use 30% of your powerwall to balance the local grid.

[stovie]

Originally Posted by Erasmo

Why would you want to eliminate the grid? Make it smarter instead!

For example a company here in the Netherlands is now offering 450 euro per year if they can use 30% of your powerwall to balance the local grid.

The thing is why maintain the grid when everyone in your city has solar and is paying the city 3-4 times its cost over 30 years?? The way your pointing out has the city/company paying out instead!!

[EchoTech]

..Don't forget good old Ontario (Canada). I can't find the exact quote right now, but our Energy Minister said our rates went up because we didn't use enough hydro. Comparing the months before and after the rate increase my usage went down 4%, my bill went up 8%. I guess you win some, you lose some.

[rmay635703]

Originally Posted by EchoTech

..Don't forget good old Ontario (Canada). I can't find the exact quote right now, but our Energy Minister said our rates went up because we didn't use enough hydro.

That is what has been happening in Wisconsin year after year for the last 15 years.

They keep adding capacities but say we aren't consuming enough power and need to raise rates.

I guess as far as I'm concerned we don't need to eliminate the grid but we do have the right to disconnect.

As Nissan starts to sell their alcohol fuel cell in Brazil I plan on paying close attention.

The time when a reliable modular way to disconnect is coming fast.

[rmay635703]

ERF - Public Comments

[redpoint5]

Originally Posted by rmay635703

ERF - Public Comments

Very interesting. That explains a lot. Also seems to have the same error and profit system in place as the housing bubble and financial collapse. Reward the idiots / scam artists, and bail out their mistakes with citizens held hostage by systems "too big to fail".

The thing about investment is that it's supposed to carry risk, with the possibility of reward being tempered by the chance of failure. Stockholders should bear the burden of unwise investments, just as they profit from wise investments.

It would be neat if utility customers could organize to not pay their monthly bill for a certain period of time in protest, until the billing and financial risk were more appropriately provisioned.

To play devil's advocate though, it is very difficult to forecast expected demand a decade in advance, which is required when deciding to build out primary generating stations. You either have too much capacity, which translates to higher costs for the consumer, or you have too little capacity, which also translates to higher costs for the consumer. The Goldilocks of power generation is an impossibly elusive and moving target.

[oil pan 4]

Originally Posted by stovie

The thing is why maintain the grid when everyone in your city has solar and is paying the city 3-4 times its cost over 30 years?? The way your pointing out has the city/company paying out instead!!

The cost of setting up a house for off grid solar can easily exceed the value of a lot of homes. Then you still have maintenance cost of the batteries, inverters, roof, wiring.
Then if you have to pay someone to come out to solve your power production issues for you it will cost even more.
Everyone who has gone to off grid solar says it's a lot more expensive than grid power.

[Fingie]

I live with my parents, but I am really interested in off-the-grid solutions whn i'll build my house. (I want a tiny one)

Sadly, we have cold winters pretty often (some years its just max - 20 Celsius, last winter the record was -35C!

Wonder if I should invest into geothermal heat, or whatever it's called in English.

[rmay635703]

Originally Posted by Fingie

I live with my parents, but I am really interested in off-the-grid solutions whn i'll build my house. (I want a tiny one)

Sadly, we have cold winters pretty often (some years its just max - 20 Celsius, last winter the record was -35C!

Wonder if I should invest into geothermal heat, or whatever it's called in English.

Or build a straw bale home, super insulation is the easiest way to save