The Decline of the Manual... But a Glimmer of Hope?

[Floppie]

Originally Posted by jcp123

I guess the $1000 for an auto trans on the option sheet is to recoup the R&D costs? These things are pretty complex to design.

I think the $1000 for an automatic transmission on the option sheet is because the market will bear $1000 for an automatic transmission

[Fat Charlie]

For only a grand more, you don't have to learn how to drive ever!

[darcane]

Originally Posted by CAPTAIN CHAOS

Yeah, those were actually 'bad' numbers at the time as the push was to bring them down into the $160's range.

Keep in mind though that my 'data' is from roughly 10 years ago. I doubt that the current cost is much over $200 though and I wouldn't be surprised if mfg improvements has kept it close to where it was when I worked there.

10 years ago (see chart on page 1) about 2/3 of all transmissions were 4-spd autos. Now cars are primarily 6-spd auto and CVTs. With the added complexity of both, I wonder if that $200 target is achievable.

Still lots of room for a hefty profit margin though.

[serialk11r]

Originally Posted by CAPTAIN CHAOS

Threads like this are part of why I come here.

Personally, I agree that drivers have become so ‘disconnected’ from the cars that much of the joy of ‘driving’ has been lost.

Nearly every driver input on a new car goes through a ‘committee’ and is ‘approved’ or ‘modified’ before being transmitted into actual change. How long before the steering is done through the computer and the driver is nothing more than a passenger (don’t think they’re not working on it)?

Well, e-throttle is a good idea because it allows the cam timing actuators, throttle, and injection to work in unison. A reactive system as with cable throttles is inherently difficult to get running both smoothly/cleanly and with quick response. The Lexus LFA had to be tuned very carefully to allow cable throttle in 2010. I'd say it's a good thing that we're letting engine management do its job and take care of running the engine, which is a critical and inherently complex function.

However automatic transmissions are far worse, because they have to translate that gas pedal reading into acceleration, not just torque.

Steer by wire already exists, Lexus LS460, and basically the entire Infiniti lineup has it. The steering wheel and steering rack have no physical connection that is. The weird thing is they have an electric motor resisting your steering inputs so that there is some "feel". Makes you wonder why they don't just hook up the steering wheel to you know, the wheels.

Brake by wire is already fairly common, and fully vectored braking is pretty common. This is the one other automated thing I don't mind, because it seems better to use the brakes this way than trying to get more grip using limited slip differentials and crappy traction control systems. However I hate the idea of automatic braking.

[samwichse]

Looks like the LS 460 doesn't have steer by wire, it has variable gear ratio steering.

Infinity is the only manufacturer dumb enough to do this yet. Take a Look Inside the First Steer-by-Wire Car | WIRED

Even so it looks like there's still a steering column with a fail safe clutch released in a computer failure that does good old manual steering.

[Frank Lee]

[serialk11r]

Originally Posted by samwichse

Looks like the LS 460 doesn't have steer by wire, it has variable gear ratio steering.

Ah, okay, I was wrong about the LS.

I've been itching to rip the power steering out of my MR2 since I owned it, but I don't know if I want to keep this particular car so I haven't yet. Manual steering ftw. If I hit the gym a bit more I won't have any trouble at all with a depowered steering pump (extra resistance to turn the wheel against), but looped PS lines would be perfect in terms of effort.

[jcp123]

I ran my Mustang manual steering for a bit. No big deal.

[Xist]

Originally Posted by serialk11r

The weird thing is they have an electric motor resisting your steering inputs so that there is some "feel".

Does that motor work as a dynamo, generating electricity from your steering effort?

[serialk11r]

Originally Posted by Xist

Does that motor work as a dynamo, generating electricity from your steering effort?

To some extent probably just because of the way electric motors work, but its efficiency is far lower than that of a direct linkage (100%) haha.

@jcp123 depowered rack is only a problem in parking maneuvers where I have to crank the wheel several turns. Unfortunately for me, parallel parking is a chore that needs to be done everyday.