Diamond Lube

[RustyLugNut]

Originally Posted by JRMichler

More hogwash. All patent applications are reviewed by the Patent Office in the order received. After review, the patent examiner sends a letter to the inventor. Typically, that letter is a rejection and lists the reasons why. The inventor then has a defined time to respond. The inventor responds with reasons why the rejection was wrong, or changes the application to make it align with the objections. This process repeats until the patent is granted or the inventor gives up. If the inventor does not respond in time, the patent application is rejected permanently.

There is no process for intentionally delaying a patent application publication. It's published 18 months after the initial application. No exceptions. The full official details are on the US Patent Office website at United States Patent and Trademark Office.

The sad thing about this whole thread is that there exists actual data on the benefits of nano diamond additives. Unfortunately, the DiamondLube website looks more like the website of a quack selling snake oil. Hence the negative reactions.

DiamondLube shows little knowledge of the American Patent process, but this doesn't make you a lawyer by profession and doesn't preclude him from hiring a good patent house with skilled people who can do the work for him though there is little evidence he has done this.

Take perverse joy, if you will, in beating down those who misrepresent the truth. But, do not become what you are fighting. Errors in your legal rant undermine your credibility.

[RustyLugNut]

Originally Posted by RedDevil

So Diamondlube does not contain fullerene. It just contains microscopic particles of the hardest material on earth, the best abrasive powder you can get. Maybe that might just work, smoothing out the surfaces in contact? Would be a first though.

Sadly, I lost interest in the matter. Time to unsubscribe from this thread.

. . . and it seems Mr DiamondLube's claim of a diamond ball is founded. His microwave process is not the only way to create "spherical clusters" of diamonds. It looks like several other processes are capable of achieving the same results on a nano scale. An Israeli company uses laser techniques to strike a target mixture of carbon and hydrocarbons. They are willing to sell gram sized samples at reasonable prices.

More poking will probably turn up more competitors to DiamondLube.

[DiamondLube]

The compression ring is the least lubricated and highest temperature contact surface in the engine, and relies on fuel to lubricate it.

What happens when the cylinder and compression ring gets Coated with atom sized balls of spherical Diamond? How many changes "if any" do you think will occur?

Originally Posted by slownugly

correct me if im wrong but the compression rings cause the most drag. there may be little to no lubrication at the pistons for a reason. i wouldnt really want that stuff toying with a good compression ring seal. what if the stuff slips past and ruins the ring seal?

we have enough problems with ethanol slipping past our rings as it is. ive seen more vehicles with oil burning problems in the last year than the last 9 weve owned our shop. regular oil is slipping by these rings, whats to say this stuff wont make things worse. 3 chevy cobalts in 6 months that burned the oil out and released the timing chain tension. bent valves.

yea ill let someone else risk the investment.

[DiamondLube]

Rusty,

And to think that ARGONNE labs told me in 2005 or so that Spherical NanoDiamond did not and could not exist. And now an Israeli company is making Unobtanium too. Wonderful. Please message me to discuss something else off list.

Originally Posted by RustyLugNut

. . . and it seems Mr DiamondLube's claim of a diamond ball is founded. His microwave process is not the only way to create "spherical clusters" of diamonds. It looks like several other processes are capable of achieving the same results on a nano scale. An Israeli company uses laser techniques to strike a target mixture of carbon and hydrocarbons. They are willing to sell gram sized samples at reasonable prices.

More poking will probably turn up more competitors to DiamondLube.

[slownugly]

Originally Posted by DiamondLube

What happens when the cylinder and compression ring gets Coated with atom sized balls of spherical Diamond? How many changes "if any" do you think will occur?

That's precisely what I'm asking. If you have oil slipping past rings how do you know if this stuff won't slip by even easier?

Edit: I'd actually consider trying this stuff on some systems like wheel bearings and power steering. Maybe tranny. How much would you inject into a wheel bearing?

[P-hack]

"Atom sized"?!? 260 picometers is the largest atom I know of. How did you confirm the presence of these diamonds being embedded?

[RustyLugNut]

Originally Posted by slownugly

That's precisely what I'm asking. If you have oil slipping past rings how do you know if this stuff won't slip by even easier?

Edit: I'd actually consider trying this stuff on some systems like wheel bearings and power steering. Maybe tranny. How much would you inject into a wheel bearing?

Energetic "burnishing" forces are needed to apply and imbed a thin coating of the particles on the surfaces. The nano coating is so thin ( a millionth of a milli meter scale ) that it will not be an interference fit on the macro scale and thus of no worry. If ring seal was properly obtained to begin with, it should stay so after a nano lubricant application.

But this brings to question the need to produce a "spherical cluster" of nano diamonds. If the nano diamonds are indeed burnished into the parent metal, the spherical shape would seem as less of an advantage over the better known prismatic shapes.

DiamondLube, you also mention a claim for a "life time" application. While I can see this being true for gears and bearings, the ring and cylinder wall are exposed to combustion temperatures exceeding 1300 degrees centigrade albeit for brief time spans before the metal mass draws off the heat to form the quench layer. Since your product is diamond and diamond starts breaking down at 450 deg C, and rapidly decays or even ignites at 1000 deg C and above, wouldn't a constant replenishment of the lubricant be needed to maintain the ring/cylinder lubrication?

[RustyLugNut]

Originally Posted by DiamondLube

Rusty,

And to think that ARGONNE labs told me in 2005 or so that Spherical NanoDiamond did not and could not exist. And now an Israeli company is making Unobtanium too. Wonderful. Please message me to discuss something else off list.

Diamond is, and can only be prismatic due to it's structure. But, it seems "clusters" can be created. What that means, I don't know at this time - but I want to.

DiamondLube, you can message me. But, understand I may not answer as I am under some restrictions due to my current employment.

[redneck]

Originally Posted by slownugly

correct me if im wrong but the compression rings cause the most drag. there may be little to no lubrication at the pistons for a reason. i wouldnt really want that stuff toying with a good compression ring seal. what if the stuff slips past and ruins the ring seal?

we have enough problems with ethanol slipping past our rings as it is. ive seen more vehicles with oil burning problems in the last year than the last 9 weve owned our shop. regular oil is slipping by these rings, whats to say this stuff wont make things worse. 3 chevy cobalts in 6 months that burned the oil out and released the timing chain tension. bent valves.

yea ill let someone else risk the investment.

It may work like this.

Dispersion effect and auto-reconditioning performance of nanometer
WS2 particles in green lubricant

http://www.ias.ac.in/matersci/bmsoct2010/529.pdf



I use WS2.

What I have found using it in engine oil is that,

1. oil consumption is down
2. oil is cleaner in appearance

This is in line with the above linked article.

As far as mpg goes, I made to many other mods during the same time to be able to attribute any gain in mpg to the WS2 added to the engine oil.

There is a lot of info published on the web as to the anti wear properties of Ws2, which is why I decided to use it in the first place.

DiamondLube is essentially saying the same thing. However, he does not produce any proof, method of testing or any results of said tests.

That's a big problem.


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[DiamondLube]

I ran across an independant test of ws2 and quicken at Picture and ws2 kind a sucks.

Originally Posted by redneck

It may work like this.

Dispersion effect and auto-reconditioning performance of nanometer
WS2 particles in green lubricant

http://www.ias.ac.in/matersci/bmsoct2010/529.pdf



I use WS2.

What I have found using it in engine oil is that,

1. oil consumption is down
2. oil is cleaner in appearance

This is in line with the above linked article.

As far as mpg goes, I made to many other mods during the same time to be able to attribute any gain in mpg to the WS2 added to the engine oil.

There is a lot of info published on the web as to the anti wear properties of Ws2, which is why I decided to use it in the first place.

DiamondLube is essentially saying the same thing. However, he does not produce any proof, method of testing or any results of said tests.

That's a big problem.


>