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Old 08-21-2016, 10:39 AM   #71 (permalink)
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I think different motors respond differently to wai. Modern engines all have different programing on the ecu. Performance oriented programing probably respond well to cai, were factory programing probably retard the timing in response to cai. I took the computer out of the equation on my 99 24v dodge. When the vp44 injection pump died I replaced it with the previous generation p7100 pump. The sensors are all still in place, but the timing and duration are fixed. I put an adjustable timing gear on so I can easily play with different settings. That makes my truck a good test bed for experiment with cai. I think performance and fe should increase as iat decreases to a point. I'm going to build a water to air cooler that should perform better than the air to air.

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Old 08-21-2016, 02:44 PM   #72 (permalink)
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Water to air coolers never preform better than air to air.
With air to air you can only ever cool the air down close to to ambient.
With air to water you can only cool the water down close to ambient and then cool the air down close to the temperature of the water.
Air to water systems also suffer from real bad heat soak.
About the only reason to run air to water is if you just don't have room for air to air.

You are wasing your time trying warm air with a cummins.
1 it has already been tried on here and confirmed.
2 the cummins engine manual says their eninges are going to get lower fuel economy and reduced power with warm air.

If you want something that will benifet from warm air get a gasser.
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Old 08-21-2016, 04:55 PM   #73 (permalink)
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not all reeders live in southern climate

Quote:
Originally Posted by oil pan 4 View Post
Water to air coolers never preform better than air to air.
With air to air you can only ever cool the air down close to to ambient.....

You are wasing your time trying warm air with a cummins.
1 it has already been tried on here and confirmed.
2 the cummins engine manual says their eninges are going to get lower fuel economy and reduced power with warm air.

If you want something that will benefit from warm air get a gasser.
I think that some clarification is needed...
so if ambient= - 20f -40f/c there is no possible improvement to try to worm it ?
aka its a good idea to have the IAT at 20 below 0f?
This is baffling in a previous post someone said to keep the air above freezing for a nonIC genset

I bought for this discussion and for general use

5-in-1 Digital Multimeter
my IAT depended on grade/boost generally staying at 10f above the 85-99f ambient. the temp. change is much slower and stable than I expected.
I added my 75%rad block between the Rad and IC. this added 10f =182f coolant and bumped IAT to as high as138f(90-110 normal @70-80mph) it also moved my EGT +100f aka 700fEGT =70mph to800f EGT = 70mph.its summer so i can only do this hafe of the experiment . had frost on my roof yesterday so the other haff is still a couple months away.

predictions
my IAT will be well below freezing wile costing down Bolder Pass.

my EGT was drooping to150ish with AC/Defrost.
my truck idles at275 in park, +25 for AC compressor, +50 put in gear(auto), and its normal to be at400f when i pull into a parking spot so a cool down of 2-5min is required(the EGT wont drop below 375f if in gear with AC on)

----
at what IAT would you recamend warming the air on a 1th gen IC Cummins? and at what point do you recomend mesuring? I'm thinking the last IC boot or the Intake Horn.
I'd like to get a data logger to record the very limited motor senders and air temp/pressure at every step of the way .
dream big chisel down to reality .
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Old 08-21-2016, 05:32 PM   #74 (permalink)
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Oil pan I'm not interested in wai. I never was. I'm interested in refrigerating it as cold as I can get it. I want to build a data logger to monitor changes. My water to air scheme will not be like others, I hope to get well below ambient temp.
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Old 08-21-2016, 11:42 PM   #75 (permalink)
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Cummins manuals say that for stationary engines that are out side operated below +20'F the air should be drawn in from inside the engine enclosure.
And run the warmed intake air any time the engine wont stay above operating temperature.
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Old 08-22-2016, 12:26 AM   #76 (permalink)
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The 6.7l ford runs two complete and separate cooling systems. One is for the block, oil, heads and the hot side of the egr system, it runs at about 200 degrees. The second system runs at about 150 degrees, it cools the water to the charge air cooler, the cool side of the egr and the fuel system. It is complicated and not put together very well, we have 6 of these at work and I have replaced the primary radiators in 5 of these trucks. One truck twice in 125k miles. They do run well and are much less problems than the eight 6.4L fords we have. LOL the 6.4L makes the 6.0 look like a good engine.
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Old 08-31-2016, 08:32 AM   #77 (permalink)
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diesel must be warm air fed,

working-living 21 years with old style diesel engine, i.e. London taxi 1970 Austin 2.2l 14:1 ratio comp, every mechanic said " cold air is best Mate" and yet on a 30-35c day here in Australia, the engine sang like new, a joy to hear, and then I knew it grumbled all the other times esp 5C winter night with bride in the back saying " will this cab get us to the hotel?" since it BLEW UP. (even longer story) I discovered petrol engine have a "stove" on the exhaust pipe to fed hot air via aluminum pipe to intake-air filter, hard "on all the time" the fuel gauge moves slowly, helping carby evaporation,, 2 of my taxi have no hot air pick up, so I found you get the same hot air pick simply by screwing aluminum heat pipe direct into trumpet on air filter, and the other end craft wire fasten onto the hot exhaust manifold with a wee extra wire to hold a aluminum foil piece , to shield the radiator fans draft. if I knew what I know now, I would have done the same for the diesel engine, diesel engines must be warm air fed, and can be done on the cheap and cheerful, under $20.

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