Double kilotank: 2,009.6 mi on one 35 gal tank ('07 Dodge Ram 2500 quad cab)

[Diesel_Dave]

I got it used on Craigslist. $50 if I remember correctly.

[slowmover]

03-09 Dodge Turbo Diesel Block Heater Bumper Plug-Geno's Garage

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[slowmover]

Originally Posted by Big Dave

Props to Diesel Dave for exemplary performance.

Much of it is due to his recognition of the importance of road speed in the road load equation.

Aero drag HP goes up with the cube of road speed.
Everything else is proportional to road speed.

Few people (me included) can keep their speed down like DD.

The numbers are based on a commute. A defined course. That is the larger context. While the average speed is part of it, it isn't as though this truck is being used for all sorts of errands and road trips. It would be inaccurate -- a misrepresentation -- to say that, "well, there's this Dodge guy running all miles at 30-mph getting X-mpg", as the use is within a defined set of parameters.

Put another vehicle making the same type of drive which is the daily work commute -- with notes to vehicle spec, climate & terrain -- then one might be able to make comparisons based on average speed.

This is not a one-off stunt with controlled conditions as with a test track and a team of drivers running 24/7 to hit 2k miles in a couple of days. Nor is it a truck used in commercial service running 200-miles from base and back to hit 2k miles in a week or so. Etc. Average speed means different things in both those tests if only for the number of acceleration and braking events.

And this "test" by DD is run daily -- summer, winter, fall and spring -- and is what elevates it beyond the above types: an ordinary guy doing an extraordinary thing. Great physical and mental discipline . . and by no means beyond the rest of us, even if our numbers don't hit this lottery-winning series.

One might say that -- with discipline in the daily grind -- one can underwrite extended vacation travel: "we're going to visit Aunt Sarah and take the kids to the Everglades and the fuel is free" based on an annual fuel budget.

Or extract the maximum miles from a particular vehicle over a given lifepan.

But if we change the commute of DD to one of a different mix of roads and distances, and throw in a climate or terrain change, while there will have been an impressive percentage increase over EPA (derived) the absolute numbers based on a given average speed won't be the same.

The average speed is not the gateway to understanding this demonstration.

If one wants to simplify this for others, then saying that DD cut his work commute bill by 75% would be better. And since GM or Ford diesel truck owners won't accomplish the absolute numerical change, the percentage change is the thing to emphasize. As in, "want to pull the fifth wheel travel trailer 2000-miles for free this summer . . . ?



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[Diesel_Dave]

Lots of great points, slomover. It's always tough comparing one fuel mileage scenario to another--try as we may, there's hardly ever a true apples-to-apples comparison.

As you've correctly pointed out, I've adapted my driving and truck to the way I use it. This is particularly true of my driving style. I've spent over 2 years keeping a daily log of every single commute. By now, it's 25 miles of choreography. And, every so often I'll find a nee helpful tweak or change that makes it a little better, and then I have to form a new habit.

Most people would be amazed how much can be gained by this continuous refinement. It's gotten so I almost never match by typical commuting FE numbers when on any other route, even if it would appear more favorable (fewer lights & stop signs, etc.).

[Big Dave]

I don’t think we are in any degree of disagreement. We do a lot of the same things.

My MPG, like DD is my daily commute. Like DD, the road is familiar and my results are very consistent. I don’t think our driving styles are much different. I make use of the F350s weight and people call me Sir Coastalot although I don’t do any engine-off coasting. Just knock it out of gear and coast with the engine idling. I can time the lights pretty well, although this isn't easy in Indiana as they have no standards of light timing.

I use the A/C as needed.

I count my errands in with commuting and treat long trips as a separate set of data.

I have alternate routes that are slower and involve less stop-and-go but I don’t use them unless I have to (Indiana has two seasons – basketball season and road construction season) because they are 10-14 miles longer and the whole point is minimum fuel burn.

I’m sure that if someone comes along with a commute routine that is even slower (on average)but has less stop-and-go, he beat both of us. The road load equation will not be denied.

Most Ford guys view me as an oddball. I suspect the majority of the Dodge Cummins community see DD the same. They like to drive like Tony Stewart, then belly ache when they can’t get over 15 MPG.

All the same a road trip might be interesting. Maybe we could go visit Phil Knox. A bit under a thousand miles one-way.

[ECONORAM]

Originally Posted by Big Dave

I can time the lights pretty well, although this isn't easy in Indiana as they have no standards of light timing.

I use the A/C as needed.

I count my errands in with commuting and treat long trips as a separate set of data.

I have alternate routes that are slower and involve less stop-and-go but I don’t use them unless I have to (Indiana has two seasons – basketball season and road construction season) because they are 10-14 miles longer and the whole point is minimum fuel burn.

Most Ford guys view me as an oddball. I suspect the majority of the Dodge Cummins community see DD the same. They like to drive like Tony Stewart, then belly ache when they can’t get over 15 MPG.

I am getting better at timing lights. It takes practice. I've also found a longer route to work (12 miles vs 7 miles), but on the longer route there are only a couple stop signs and one light. And no traffic. The truck hits 5th at 45 mph and I can dawdle along at 40 after that. It takes the same amount of time either way because the shorter route is so congested... I hear you on the irate driver stuff.

Hadn't thought about separating long trips versus commutes, at least not formally.

Whole-heartly agree on the Tony Stewart mindset out there. In fact, I can't even get my wife to understand my truck will get 30 mpg OR go 70 mph. It can't do both (yet).

Congrats DD on the super tank! And I thought I was doing good getting my first tank (ever) over 500 miles this year...see attached.

My condolences on the pooch. We lost our beloved Maltese in 03, and my wife has refused to get a dog since.

I do have some side-skirt envy, as yours are taller than mine are. I'm looking to build hinges into mine, so I can flip them inward and slide under the truck for mx. You might look at getting a front aero splitter also, to better control airflow under the truck.
I might be able to dig up the part number for the lower grill block--between the tow hooks, as my truck has one installed from the factory. I've toyed with opening that, and blocking off everything else a daytona nose or bird beak of some sort. I tried to run a nearly full block like yours, but found my truck was losing a couple percent of mpg... Now I only run a small piece in front of where I have my warm air intake drawing air through the radiator. Good for a MAP vehicle, not so much for MAFs.

[Joggernot]

Originally Posted by ECONORAM

Whole-heartly agree on the Tony Stewart mindset out there. In fact, I can't even get my wife to understand my truck will get 30 mpg OR go 70 mph. It can't do both (yet).

And I thought I was the only one with this problem. With the Tacoma I get 24-25 mpg on a 5 mile, cold-start, city drive. The wife gets 16 mpg. (EPA city is 14; combined is 16; highway is 18.) Basically the same route with seven traffic lights. We can't time the lights because most are on trip, but two are not. This forces at least one stop (ignition off) on the trip.

Joggernot

[euromodder]

That's totally nuts, DD

I had a tough time getting 57 MPG with the 1.6L Volvo
You're doing it with a white whale


Bummer to hear about your shepherd though.

[slowmover]

Most people would be amazed how much can be gained by this continuous refinement. It's gotten so I almost never match by typical commuting FE numbers when on any other route, even if it would appear more favorable (fewer lights & stop signs, etc.).

This matches up with the way I drive the 367 Pete in the oilfield, but it has to do with "no wasted motion" in getting a load from customer to consignee. Not a race, but to avoid the loss of momentum (to describe the physical/mental demands on the driver). The roads, the turns are all famlliar . . what changes is the traffic load (increasing) and the pavement deterioration. So running alternate routes to check them if not seen in a few weeks or months when deadheading empty back to the yard is also part of strategizing any future given load to a drilling rig that (on an average) moves every month or few months. With a given HOS (hours-of-service) which limits how long one can work in a 24-hour period, and on a weekly basis (a 6/2 schedule which allows more time off than the legal requirement) one must be on ones toes in order to get a second load if it is at all possible that day. And it is amazing how easily the time disappears . . there is no way one can speed up as in a car to "make time".

The times/distances involved for acceleration and braking events are substantial . . so even a pair of full stops on one route may be offset at some times of weekday by going OOR (out-of-route) by up to fifteen miles. Gimme a bigger road and non-stop runnnig over traffic backing up at a "T" highway intersection, for instance.

Continuous refinement, yes, and not so different mentally.

I count my errands in with commuting and treat long trips as a separate set of data.

Same here, but break it out further for highway (loaded) and highway (towing).

Over the differences cited by CUMMINS in FE comparisons (vehicle spec, terrain, climate and driver use [in that order]) the way we conceive of our vehicles is the real difference between any of us. The race car driver comment is to that end. We may meet in an averaged area of concern, but we aren't so different from those types. Just our desired results which are numerically-based, but cannot be separated from the definitions we run within.

I look to vehicle longevity first, reliability second, and fuel economy third. I find FE a good gauge per-tank on how I am working towards these mutual ends. Tire and brake life is another. I don't care at all about per-tank numbers in reality, only the percentage change to the averaged baseline. For in the end, my fuel cost is an historical fact and my thoughts, feelings or motivations only matter insofar that results change.

Our average mph is one thing, but road speed is near meaningless in a general way (to stretch the point) as so much else is condition-dependent.

Back to the race boy theme: I am amazed that so few take any interest at al in improving the annual average so that the same annual fuel budget (constant fuel price) will pay for vacation travel towing altogether (5k miles is a near norm). I've had no takers the several times I've brought it up on three different RV boards (detailed long posts on the how-to from my own experience: percentage changes).

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[Noahfreak]

Originally Posted by slowmover

[B]

Back to the race boy theme: I am amazed that so few take any interest at al in improving the annual average so that the same annual fuel budget (constant fuel price) will pay for vacation travel towing altogether (5k miles is a near norm). I've had no takers the several times I've brought it up on three different RV boards (detailed long posts on the how-to from my own experience: percentage changes).

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It's funny that you mention this because I've been the racecar type my whole life, and I think the enthusiasm that comes with that is very easy to apply to ecomodding. Throughout the years I've noticed that most (not all) performance modifications that I've done to cars have also resulted in FE improvements, and that's always a consideration, so it's not a completely new thing for me. It's also not unprecedented for a hot-rodder like myself to care about the lifetime cost of a modification, in addition to the initial cost. Most of us are on limited budgets, which is why we are modding in the first place, instead of buying the newest gadgetry from Detroit or overseas.
That said, I bought a 1988 F150 about 2 years ago and economy (fuel and otherwise) is a close second to utility for this build. I've already rebuilt the 8.8 rear end (put in a new limited slip carrier since the spider gears were worn on the old one), the 4.9L engine, and I'm about to swap out the M5R2 5-speed for the ZF wide ratio 5-speed which I'm hoping will help both on the low end, especially while loaded, with a numerically higher 1st gear, and while cruising with the numerically lower overdrive. I think the current 3.55 gears with that new tranny will probably put it in that sweet spot while on California's 65 mph freeways, which unfortunately put my 4.9 at about 2150 rpm currently, a little too high for economy on that engine. Those are the mods I came up with by my past experience with modding cars.
After discovering this forum and cruising it for 5 minutes, I realized the goldmine of information that I stumbled upon immediately. I then signed up, and within a couple of hours, I was convinced that I needed vacuum gauges for both the F150 and my DD Saturn SC2, and they are currently in the mail. I also picked up a scan tool for the F150 to make sure all of my sensors are working properly. While I don't think I'll ever even halve the mpg number of the OP on this thread, I at least hope to get in the mid 20s with the F150 on long trips. My best tank so far was 15mpg. And since I've already increased my Saturn's stock mpg from about 23 city / 28 highway to 28 city / 42 (best, average is high 30s) highway with a few basic mods (intake, injectors and hotter ignition / bigger spark gap), I think I might be able to hit 50 with that little car by adding the boost gauge alone. Hopefully I can keep my foot out of the throttle and have just as much fun (without the trouble) as I did with my hot-rod days.