Elon Musk has no influence in the Strategic and Policy Forum

[oil pan 4]

The only tech the US is going to miss out on will be thorium nuclear reactors. Only because of public fear and ignorance towards anything nuclear. No treaty or accord is going to change that.

The US is still number 1 by far the most prolific geothermal producer.
US is the number 1 wind power producer ahead of china, as of a few years ago, they may have surpassed the US.
The US was the top hydroelectric power producer for decades, but has been surpassed by Canada, china and brazil, but we cant build any more hydroelectric dams here. US hydroelectric has actually been trending down the last 20 years because of growing demand for water.
The US is one of the top solar power producers neck and neck with japan and Germany, china is number 1 but that's where all the panels are made there because they can make them the cheapest of anyone due to having rice cheap labor, no environmental regulations or concerns for worker safety.

What would the US be missing out on exactly?

[cRiPpLe_rOoStEr]

Originally Posted by oil pan 4

The US was the top hydroelectric power producer for decades, but has been surpassed by Canada, china and brazil, but we cant build any more hydroelectric dams here. US hydroelectric has actually been trending down the last 20 years because of growing demand for water.

I don't see why hydroelectric power would affect the demand for water so badly.

The US is one of the top solar power producers neck and neck with japan and Germany, china is number 1 but that's where all the panels are made there because they can make them the cheapest of anyone due to having rice cheap labor, no environmental regulations or concerns for worker safety.

Though I'm not totally unfavorable to environmental regulations, it's clear that the U.S.A. is being affected by unfair competition from China and other "developing" countries, but we also can't deny that some Americans are too proud to look at successful experiences from other countries and try to replicate them. Sure, the nanny-state and the very same "environmental" regulations might turn it harder to implement some energy-efficient tricks, but there is still that not-invented-here mentality preventing good ideas to benefit the average Joe.

[sendler]

Fact-checking Donald Trump's statement withdrawing from the Paris climate agreement | PolitiFact
.
If you actually read the language of the Climate Accord that each country agreed to, it has some contradictions and loosely worded sections that don't really add up such as India stating that they will cut carbon to 33% of 2005 levels by 2030 but also double coal production between 2015 and 2020. There is also language stating that any reductions would be dependant on not impeding the efforts to erradicate poverty in the country and that coal is the only viable option.
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So, did India really stand any chance of even coming close to a 33% reduction over 13 years? 13 years? Really? There are 260 Million people in India that don't even have any electrcal service. Yet. That's like a whole country. I doubt they will realistically have ANY reduction in that short time frame.
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So the point is, The Climate Accord was a Grand Idea. But contained some pie in the sky, kumbaya unattainable goals by major players.
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[oil pan 4]

Originally Posted by cRiPpLe_rOoStEr

I don't see why hydroelectric power would affect the demand for water.

I know Texas has decommissioned 2 hydroelectric dams I know of due to water demand.
Problem was if they ran the turbines during the spring and summer when they had water the lake water level would be way down by late summer when it didn't rain enough. Most of Texas is drought or deluge, never get enough rain unless it all comes at once.

Also about china's solar panels, they make pretty much all the rare earth metals. So if the US wanted to produce solar panels we would still have to buy the rare earths from them.

[jamesqf]

Originally Posted by oil pan 4

Also about china's solar panels, they make pretty much all the rare earth metals. So if the US wanted to produce solar panels we would still have to buy the rare earths from them.

Not true. The Chinese mine most of the rare earth metals for the same reason they make most of the solar panels: they can do it cheaply, and supply the existing demand. If the demand increases, or China decides to artificially raise the price or limit exports, there are other deposits (including some in the US) that could be mined: https://mrdata.usgs.gov/mineral-resources/ree.html

[Hersbird]

Too bad this forum doesn't have a lounge area to keep these political threads out of the useful space

Oh wait! My bad! I see political stuff isn't even allowed in the lounge. Maybe we need a backroom of the lounge so we can get back to stuff like cars?

[acparker]

Originally Posted by cRiPpLe_rOoStEr

I don't see why hydroelectric power would affect the demand for water so badly.

Demands from ecoloons have had the greatest impact on management of existing reservoirs, (blocking) plans for new hydroelectric projects and the decommissioning/demolition of existing dams.

Every dam is managed based on priorities of use: water storage, hydropower, flood control, recreation, navigation. Those priorities will be different for each dam and will vary, based on precipitation and demand.

While protection of wildlife has been a factor in the planning, construction and management of dams since about WWII, priority in recent years has been given, through litigation and administrative fiat, to maintenance of wildlife habitat.

In the ecoloon world, dams are as bad as oil, coal and nuclear. Hydropower is not allowed to be factored as renewable energy when calculating for carbon mitigation.

Ecoloons would have us save earth's creatures (and our grandchildren) from the evils of carbon by paving it with photovoltaics and mirrors, stippling the globe with giant, bat and bird macerating, wind turbines, and weaving a dense net of high voltage power lines between them all. A dystopian utopian's vision.

Now, if wind and solar power were used to pump water back behind existing dams, it could be called energy storage, then wildlife be damned and everything would be right in utopia.

[freebeard]

Hersbird — General Efficiency Discussion

Assume ad argumentum that there exists a set Politics and a set Efficiency. The non-overlapping part of Politics is vast.

[Hersbird]

Politics and environmental concerns actually hurt all aspects of efficiency. Get rid of all regulations and we will have affordable 70+ mpg cars within a year. Elio wasn't doing 3 wheels to try and save money, they were doing 3 wheels to try and skirt SOME of the regulations. Eliminate the regulations and Mitsubishi could sell a simplified Mirage for Elio's targets next year. Give them more time knowing there are no emissions or safety mandatory levels and they could do even better.

See now we are at least talking cars...

[freebeard]

A loophole big enough to drive a 1903 Rolls-Royce Silver Ghost through:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Low_Vo...rs_Act_of_2015

As always, Jason Torchinsky brings the schooling:

Jalopnik: New 'Low-Volume' Replica Car Bill Is Great Save For One Big Problem

Free your mind and your @ss will follow; I think that's in the Bible.