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Old 09-24-2015, 03:15 PM   #51 (permalink)
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What bothers me more that it is illegal to fiddle with ECU, but its completely legit to manufacture and sell cars with gearboxes designed according to test conditions, not real driving needs (so the engine runs either too low, or too high in real driving conditions).

(Set aside fact that it is also legal to strip the car down for test purposes)

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Old 09-24-2015, 06:07 PM   #52 (permalink)
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It is human nature to try to game systems. The problem is when those systems are actually in place to produce positive results. Then gaming the system becomes "getting away with it". And every time someone does get away with something, and gets caught, the system has to account for that.

That's how we get stupefying systems like California's emissions requirements.

I just wonder what new idiocy is going to wind up put in place because of VW's cheating the system?



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Old 09-24-2015, 06:23 PM   #53 (permalink)
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In other news...
VW may be gaming emissions, unlike American car manufacturers.
But all is not well on the other side of the pond either:
Car industry 'buried report revealing US car safety flaws over fears for TTIP deal' | Business News | News | The Independent

Now do we put up with a dirty life or a clean kill?
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Old 09-24-2015, 09:47 PM   #54 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RedDevil View Post
In other news...
VW may be gaming emissions, unlike American car manufacturers.
But all is not well on the other side of the pond either:
Car industry 'buried report revealing US car safety flaws over fears for TTIP deal' | Business News | News | The Independent
Hmm, so in other words the total BS that euro cars aren't safe enough to be sold here should be overturned and we should be able to

once again

LEGALLY import gray market cars without penalty or any required modifications or tests.

Lousy *******s.

I always wanted a VW Lupo and now I should be able to have it since it obviously exceeds our crash test ratings by default.

I guess what I have always said was true and everyone that argued with me to the contrary was wrong.

Ah well.
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Old 09-25-2015, 04:55 PM   #55 (permalink)
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I had a question from a coworker. Has anyone seen a comparison of the current gen TDIs actual emissions vs the last generation? He is wondering how much worse 40 times EPA actually is vs the older engines.
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Old 09-25-2015, 05:01 PM   #56 (permalink)
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I don't have the source, but someone on the TDI Club forum posted numbers showing the 2.0 has worse NOx emissions than any VW diesel ever sold here. He put the numbers up for the original Rabbit diesel, but I forget the details. It's buried in a hundreds of pages long discussion of mostly useless speculation over there.
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Old 09-26-2015, 10:43 AM   #57 (permalink)
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Just a redneck/silly thought/question:

It doesn´t look like the "device" was switched manually during official tests. More likely it seems that it was piece of code in the ECU looking for specific driving conditions. Doesn't that mean, that IF you would drive EXACTLY as EPA wants you to drive, the "device" will kick in and emissions will be as low as stated even on road??? If you could drive according to EPA standards, you would have results as EPA tests.

Where is problem now? If the tests do not simulate real conditions including all its varieties, all measurements sucks.

Why don´t we take homologation tests with real drivers under real conditions? If jury of ordinary volunteers is good enough for U.S. court, why is not jury of ordinary driver Joes and Marys good for EPA tests?

Last edited by seifrob; 09-26-2015 at 10:50 AM..
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Old 09-26-2015, 11:09 AM   #58 (permalink)
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I understand uk is now going the process of measuring emissions by driving on ordinary roads. How this will be implemented is anyones guess. Should be far more accurate. Also bmw is being investigated for dodgy diesel emissions. Ummmmm so thats 2 out 3 prestige german makes under microscope. As vw supplies engines to audi.
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Old 09-26-2015, 09:25 PM   #59 (permalink)
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The more interesting thing is the CA smog tests were recently changed for newer cars so all the test involved is hooking up to the OBDII port and making sure it has no codes. In other words, trust the car's computer completely to tell whether the emissions equipment is working.

This saves a lot of time and money for consumers, smog tests can be done with nothing but a computer and OBDII connector, no more dyno and sniffers, etc.

I do hope this doesn't get changed because of VW cheating.
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Old 09-26-2015, 10:28 PM   #60 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rmay635703 View Post
Hmm, so in other words the total BS that euro cars aren't safe enough to be sold here should be overturned and we should be able to

once again

LEGALLY import gray market cars without penalty or any required modifications or tests.

Lousy *******s.

I always wanted a VW Lupo and now I should be able to have it since it obviously exceeds our crash test ratings by default.

I guess what I have always said was true and everyone that argued with me to the contrary was wrong.

Ah well.
Well here is the "buried" report http://deepblue.lib.umich.edu/bitstr...=1&isAllowed=y
It shows the EU cars are better in some areas and the US cars are better in other areas. The real problem is for a car to be sold in the US it has to meet the US specs. While the EU car might be better in even most areas, it still has to meet all areas and be tested to confirm as per US law. Maybe this trade deal (which is potentially bad in many areas) will actually prove to be good in this one.

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