Friends are ditching their gasser for an EV (Leaf? Volt?) Update: Bolt!

[jamesqf]

Originally Posted by ME_Andy

So that saves, like, 25 bucks a couple times a year? Yeah, im not impressed

It's not the money, it's the time spent going to/from the rental place, and the hassle of dealing with the counter staff & paperwork.

[Grant-53]

I have been to the 1000 Island area a number of times and it is very flat. I might consider a couple of aero mod e-bikes and a four door truck such as a V6 5 speed Frontier or Ranger with a cap and utility trailer.

[Xist]

I am not impressed, either.

She is spending an additional $300 yearly on gas compared to an Equinox, $400 over an Impala, and $700 instead of a Malibu, all the same model year, according to the EPA.

Yes, renting vehicles is annoying. What is the ROI on a Malibu and trailer?

[jamesqf]

Originally Posted by Xist

What is the ROI on a Malibu and trailer?

Buy a used trailer off Craigslist or similar, and if you keep it in good repair, you can probably sell it years later for about what you paid.

Same applies to older Toyota pickups, but some people would rather spend lots of money on new & shiny stuff :-)

[MetroMPG]

Coincidentally, I saw the first Leaf in town a few days ago.

No word on what my friends have decided, though. I'll be seeing them tonight, and will see if there's any news.

In other news... someone else I know is testing-driving a Volt next week. I've been working on him for a few years. He was VERY interested in the ForkenSwift. But ultimately his wife will decide.

[MetroMPG]

Originally Posted by Grant-53

I have been to the 1000 Island area a number of times and it is very flat. I might consider a couple of aero mod e-bikes and a four door truck such as a V6 5 speed Frontier or Ranger with a cap and utility trailer.

Yes, very flat alongside the mighty St. Lawrence River. (Though consistently slightly downhill, going east. )

---

But I don't think the e-bike idea would fly with her. (She would use the EV most, locally.)

He rides his (pedal) bike to work 3 seasons.

[msd1107]

Some people are considering an EV in addition to another vehicle. However, consider:

When driving, an EV has no tail pipe emissions. An ICE has federally mandated maximum emission and fuel usage limits. If the country want lower, mandate it.

The problems start when the journey ends.

An ICE has no further emissions.

An EV plugs in to recharge. The electric company operates in an optimal manner, attempting to minimize energy costs and pollution generation. They have to furnish additional energy to recharge the EV. This energy is either/and higher cost or higher polluting. The situation just gets worse depending on the time of day and the number of EVs. This pollution level is higher than the pollution generated by the ICE. There is NO way to finesse this issue.

The EV pays no fuel taxes to repair the roads they are using. They use the most expensive electricity, but pay at the average cost. Both of these burden the rest of society with the higher costs that EVs cause.

There are many other deleterious effects. The additional energy used comes from the most highly polluting generators. The electric industry is moving as quickly as possible to use lower polluting generators and retire highly polluting generators so being forced to supply more energy slows down this transition, forcing society as a whole to breathe more polluted air and pay more for electricity. The increased load from recharging EVs causes the electric companies to upgrade their transmission networks (especially the local transformers). This cost is born be society as a whole, not the EV owner.

So, do not go EV and save the planet!

[redpoint5]

Originally Posted by msd1107

An ICE has federally mandated maximum emission and fuel usage limits. If the country want lower, mandate it.

Good point.

The EV pays no fuel taxes to repair the roads they are using.

That isn't a problem with EVs, but a failure of tax codes.

Infrastructure should be funded through general tax revenue and not be use based at all. Even people that don't own a vehicle rely on the infrastructure for the goods and services they consume. Goods don't just magically appear in the home. People who come to visit had to use roads to get there.

We all benefit from infrastructure either directly or indirectly and should pay for them through regular income or sales taxes. This eliminates the problem of trying to estimate what the use will be, and what the use-based tax amount should be. Instead, you calculate the needed revenue and tax accordingly.

The additional energy used comes from the most highly polluting generators.

How do you figure? My EV is recharged with hydroelectricity. Most EVs are charged at off-peak hours, meaning the most efficient power generators are supplying the energy. It's the peaking generators that are least efficient, and those are mostly used on hot days when air conditioners are running to cool homes and offices.

The increased load from recharging EVs causes the electric companies to upgrade their transmission networks (especially the local transformers).

Do you have evidence of this? As I said earlier, EVs are charged off-peak, so additional infrastructure isn't necessary.

BTW, electricity consumption in the US peaked in 2005, long before EVs were around.



...and the grid is trending cleaner.

[freebeard]

Well, since we're feeding the troll; when you complete your journey and turn off the ICE, the fuel refineries, delivery trucks and electrically powered pumps continue apace — pardon my French, but metal hurlant.

[redpoint5]

Originally Posted by freebeard

Well, since we're feeding the troll

Hey, he has been on the forum longer than I have. At this rate, we should expect the next pearl of wisdom to arrive sometime in 2022. I'm holding my breath.