Friends do not let friends buy Volkswagons

[jcp123]

He probably wasn't very good on maintenance, however, the myriad electrical gremlins really shouldn't have been occurring. He bought it new in '96 I think, or '97. He had it for about 4 years. I was too young to really know much about what was going on, but I remember it having a starting problem, a pretty bad hesitation, occasional stalling without warning, and (I'm guessing it was taken to a shop), there were electrical problems on the car.

[ninetynineSC2]

Originally Posted by jcp123

He probably wasn't very good on maintenance, however, the myriad electrical gremlins really shouldn't have been occurring. He bought it new in '96 I think, or '97. He had it for about 4 years. I was too young to really know much about what was going on, but I remember it having a starting problem, a pretty bad hesitation, occasional stalling without warning, and (I'm guessing it was taken to a shop), there were electrical problems on the car.

Not sure you're even mildly interested in this but...

I can hazard a guess as to what was causing those surprisingly common issues. Stalling, hesitation, starting problem (Honestly had this issue) = a $10 sensor. Yup a freaking $10 sensor. What happened was GM cheaped and out wouldn't allow engineers to use quality parts (surprise surprise ) and used a plastic tipped sensor to measure coolant temperature, plastic tip + hot coolant = a bad time. They changed that sensor to a brass tip in 2000. The plastic tip would crack and make the computer think the car was running very, very cool so the computer would try to compensate by dumping more fuel through the injectors while everything else was expecting the lesser, warm engine amount. Basically would the car would act pretty much like one with a flooded/poorly tuned carburetor.

Electrical gremlins = Most likely he was using the cigarette lighter to charge something. While most cars you can get away with this, Saturn designed the lighter as just that. A lighter, nothing more nothing less. The continued load from charging a device would eventually burn out the lighter wiring ,among others, at the fusebox which would mess with the fuel pump connection at the box as well, meaning both electrical AND running problems. Can't say I've had this issue as I don't have anything that would need charged in the car.

[2000mc]

Originally Posted by jcp123

a starting problem, a pretty bad hesitation, occasional stalling without warning

3 issues potentially caused by a single problem, and someone that couldn't figure it out. 246k here, maybe I just tend to scrape the burnt bits off my toast

[Xist]

I had not realized that the Passport was made by Isuzu. I believe that a friend has one. I just know that Isuzu has trucks that match Chevrolet ones, so I grouped those.

It really seems like Lexus is the only consistently reliable luxury car.

Fords do not seem to compare well, but Dad took care of his, and they lasted him well.

[Frank Lee]

There is another aspect to "reliability" that isn't represented by the chart; that is how difficult and/or expensive are regular service and common repairs? I recall stories about VWs with cam timing systems at the BACK of the engine that require engine removal to service, and stupid stuff like that.

[user removed]

R&R engine to replace knock sensor, R&R engine to replace front cover to engine block seal.

Some of the resons I don't work on them anymore.

regards
mech

[jcp123]

Originally Posted by ninetynineSC2

Not sure you're even mildly interested in this but...

I can hazard a guess as to what was causing those surprisingly common issues. Stalling, hesitation, starting problem (Honestly had this issue) = a $10 sensor. Yup a freaking $10 sensor. What happened was GM cheaped and out wouldn't allow engineers to use quality parts (surprise surprise ) and used a plastic tipped sensor to measure coolant temperature, plastic tip + hot coolant = a bad time. They changed that sensor to a brass tip in 2000. The plastic tip would crack and make the computer think the car was running very, very cool so the computer would try to compensate by dumping more fuel through the injectors while everything else was expecting the lesser, warm engine amount. Basically would the car would act pretty much like one with a flooded/poorly tuned carburetor.

Electrical gremlins = Most likely he was using the cigarette lighter to charge something. While most cars you can get away with this, Saturn designed the lighter as just that. A lighter, nothing more nothing less. The continued load from charging a device would eventually burn out the lighter wiring ,among others, at the fusebox which would mess with the fuel pump connection at the box as well, meaning both electrical AND running problems. Can't say I've had this issue as I don't have anything that would need charged in the car.

Interesting...I can believe the sensor bit. Don't think he had anything to charge, (pre-cell phone days, mostly) but I don't know for sure. Either way, it left such a bad taste in my mouth that Saturns have always been up on my list of cars banned from consideration. Maybe I'm wrong about that, but 15 years of thinking shall be hard to reverse

[Xist]

Well, there are slightly fewer Saturns every year...

[ninetynineSC2]

Originally Posted by Xist

Well, there are slightly fewer Saturns every year...

There's slightly fewer Pontiac every year too...

[jcp123]

Back on topic...I still kind of want a ca. 2000ish TDi manual Golf or Jetta. Lay it low on GTI/Wolfsburg suspension, maybe a tune...

...alas, they are all getting up there in age and I dread the timing belt changes every 60k. Not quite worth it, even if they had old-school Japanese reliability.

Or I could go for a real unicorn: a Passat W8 MT wagon.