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Old 11-15-2009, 12:19 PM   #11 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by dcb View Post
It's hard for me to understand being willfully wasteful when our sons and daughters are overseas sacrificing everything.
My car gets better mileage at 80 than 70, and better at 60 than 70. 70's a compromise pick that works for neither extreme.

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Old 11-15-2009, 12:40 PM   #12 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Casey View Post
My car gets better mileage at 80 than 70, and better at 60 than 70. 70's a compromise pick that works for neither extreme.
That is a most dubious claim

1996 BMW 318


faster takes more energy, period. any car can be crippled to merely look better at a higher speed while actually being more wasteful.
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Old 11-15-2009, 02:41 PM   #13 (permalink)
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It's hard for me to understand being willfully wasteful when our sons and daughters are overseas sacrificing everything.
Huh? What dillusional parallel universe do you pretend to dwell in? OK, I see that you live on "3rd rock", which isn't really why they put that "where are you?" thing on the control panel. They put it there so that somehow we might understand where you're coming from, or perhaps understand why can't figure out where you're coming from, and likewise back. So I wonder if you're one of those "I am a citizen of the world" goofballs, as if living in the US of A wasn't specTACularly better than, say, Botswana because of who our predecessors have willed us to be. Which includes, incidentally, being a land of plenty. So our sons and daughters are sacrificing so that we might live free. Including the right to, I don't know, do things that others might, well, disapprove of. So, I'm a minimalist. By American standards, of course. I live in a house that has, heck, 10 times the number of rooms I and my family absolutely need. Yeah, it's a 10 room house. Not counting the 2 bathrooms. And I live on something like 2200-2500 calories a day. And I have several changes of clothes. And I buy a new toothbrush every year.
Now, if your complaint is based on the shortage of petroleum, we (the US of A) sit on larger known reserves than anybody can comprehend, and technology advances make it clear that there are even more reserves than we know so far. But we can't drill because of some damn intellectual elitist treehuggers who are convinced that (contrary to real scientific data) we are "destroying the planet!" Were you there when the Cuyahoga River caught on fire? Have you seen it lately? The part of the world that lies within the bounds of the US of A is so much incredibly cleaner than it was 40 years ago! America is good for the environment. We invented clean technology. Not Europe. Not Japan. Definitely not the Arab world or China. Why? So we can continue to bloody well be Americans. THAT's why my baby daughter served her tour in Iraq during the bloodiest years. THAT's why she found it noble to serve, why she was willing to put up with the sexist abuse of the Iraqi men she was risking her life for. Because she thinks that living in the land of plenty, the home of the free and the brave, was worth risking her ass for. So that her sister and her brothers would have the oportunity to live out the American dream, to make the most out of their life, to raise their kids in a land of blessing. NOT so that we could all live like they live in, say, Somalia. You have the audacity to call somebody driving 80mph "wasteful". And to imply that being "wasteful" is disrespectful of our soldiers. Crawl out from under "3rd rock" and sniff reality. Assuming you live in America (and that's not only a continent, it also defines a country) you might notice that you live in a great country because we are meant to be free from pathetic narrowminded prudish nanny-ism.
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Old 11-15-2009, 04:00 PM   #14 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dcb View Post
That is a most dubious claim

1996 BMW 318


faster takes more energy, period. any car can be crippled to merely look better at a higher speed while actually being more wasteful.
Year and a half driving the same exact route, same time of day, roughly even the same traffic load. I get 31mpg highway at 60mph, 30mpg at 70, and 31mpg again at 80. It's repeatable, at least in my car.
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Old 11-15-2009, 04:32 PM   #15 (permalink)
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pstrbrc, I am free, free to point out your personal attacks are taken as a sign that I have struck a nerve. Do you think personal sacrifice and responsibility is someone elses job? Too much talk about personal rights and nothing of personal responsibility, but without the latter the former is untenable, IMHO. I don't like nannys any more than ignoramuses. But most would agree we use/consume way more than we need already (except those with something to sell to consumers or stock in said same).

If I think an activity is ultimately wasteful (in resources and human lives) am I not free to say that without being attacked personally? Am I not free to appreciate the efforts of our current and past armed forces and pressure my peers to think about something other than themselves?

Casey, my point is that it takes more energy to go faster, basic physics. This fact can be obscured by technical implementation details of a particular car, but with a properly sized engine and gearing lower mph = better mpg. A 318 can cruise at above 40mpg on the hiway, if there aren't loudmouth jerks trying to run you off the road complaining about how you are violating their right to speed wherever and whenever they want.
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Old 11-15-2009, 04:37 PM   #16 (permalink)
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...I'm surprised no one yet has: (A) directed comment to the HP-vs-MPH graphing tool posted here, or (B) pulled up and displayed the MPG-vs-MPH curve for the Z06 Corvette, or (C) gotten the DOE chart showing FATALITY rate vs MPH crash data, etc.

...facts don't silence criticism, but they DO tend to make them mumble more.
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Old 11-15-2009, 07:01 PM   #17 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pstrbrc View Post
...Utah is not known for its densely populated metro areas. It's known for long straight empty stretches of highway. When 55 was the "national" speed limit, those of us who drive those long empty straight highways almost died of boredom. 65 was survivable, and 75 is pretty darn nice. And, no, it's not remotely "dangerous". Now, somebody living in western Massachusetts might not get this, but a 300 mile trip one way is fairly common out here on the Plains, and there is no other choice but the car. For me, the difference between 60mph and 70 mph is 2.2 gallons versus 1.5 hours. And when that 600 mile round trip has to be done in one day, that hour and a half less driving is very much a big safety factor...
I agree that i did jump to conclusions when i first posted this. U make a lot of good points in this post. It's been a long, long time since i've been to Utah, but from what i remember, exactly like u said: miles and miles and miles of nothing. I can understand why people would want to go 80 MPH there.

Now i don't believe states with closer cities and more traffic like MA should raised there pls to 80, but it would make some sense with states like Utah.

I personally wouldn't want to go that fast now, but i have driven around 75 back in the day when i used to travel from NC to MA, before i started really hypermiling. Granted, my f/e wasn't all that great but all i wanted to do was get home, so i can see where ur coming from.

It's been a while since i've driven that fast, and i plan to keep it that way so i can see better f/e. I'll stick to the right lane and let the guys who wanna go faster use the other lanes.
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Old 11-15-2009, 07:17 PM   #18 (permalink)
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Just two questions:

...which COSTS you more: TIME or GASOLINE?

...which is a CONSUMABLE item and which isn't?

...somewhere in-between is a common "null" point, we just have to find and agree on it.
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Old 11-15-2009, 07:38 PM   #19 (permalink)
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I just got it, it was an article promoting herd mentality

"As a herd, we will find ways"
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Old 11-15-2009, 07:49 PM   #20 (permalink)
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Old Tele man -

Quote:
Originally Posted by Old Tele man View Post
Just two questions:

...which COSTS you more: TIME or GASOLINE?
...which is a CONSUMABLE item and which isn't?

...somewhere in-between is a common "null" point, we just have to find and agree on it.
I remember a thread way back where the fellow argued that his time was worth more than the cost of gas. He looked at his time in terms of his hourly wage, and then added up the minutes over the course of a year. From his POV, time was always more important.

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