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Old 07-18-2018, 12:29 PM   #51 (permalink)
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Winsight - '00 Honda Insight
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Wait wut. B series isn't any bigger than the D.

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Old 07-18-2018, 12:39 PM   #52 (permalink)
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Gaptooth (retired) - '00 Honda Insight
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90 day: 54.26 mpg (US)

Such Fit - '07 Honda Fit Sport
90 day: 41.27 mpg (US)

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90 day: 23.4 mpg (US)

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Baltothewolf View Post
Wait wut. B series isn't any bigger than the D.
My bad. Interesting that the D15 has the same deck height as a K20.
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Old 07-18-2018, 07:08 PM   #53 (permalink)
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Gaptooth (retired) - '00 Honda Insight
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Such Fit - '07 Honda Fit Sport
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Some parts are ordered! For various reasons, I ended up going with:

K24A JDM motor with ~40k miles - $1000
Type R 10lb flywheel - $150
2005 TSX transmission with lightweight magnesium housing - $800
RSX ECU and engine harness - $450
Civic Si LSD - $300

Will post as I collect more. Will need O2 sensors, catalyst, axles, Accord throttlebody (sticking with a throttle cable).
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Old 07-18-2018, 08:54 PM   #54 (permalink)
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Volt, gas only - '12 Chevrolet Volt Premium
90 day: 38.02 mpg (US)

Volt, electric only - '12 Chevrolet Volt Premium
90 day: 132.26 mpg (US)

Yukon Denali Hybrid - '12 GMC Yukon Denali Hybrid
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Here's another question: What is the priority split between efficiency/livability/fun?

I ask because if you have a lot of power in a fwd, very light car... any thoughts about awd from a cr-v?
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Old 07-19-2018, 07:31 AM   #55 (permalink)
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Gaptooth (retired) - '00 Honda Insight
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Gen-1 Insights
90 day: 54.26 mpg (US)

Such Fit - '07 Honda Fit Sport
90 day: 41.27 mpg (US)

Connect - '15 Ford Transit Connect XL
90 day: 23.4 mpg (US)

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Quote:
Originally Posted by ksa8907 View Post
Here's another question: What is the priority split between efficiency/livability/fun?

I ask because if you have a lot of power in a fwd, very light car... any thoughts about awd from a cr-v?
Hard to say exactly. I'm mostly making it up as I go.

I was able to justify this in my head when comparing the price of fixing the 2nd gear grind AND eventually replacing the hybrid battery in my car, against a swap. I could probably continue driving my transmission until I tore the gears up, but to fix the synchro issue would involve an $800 refurbished transmission, $300 round trip shipping, and I'd probably want a new flywheel ($200) and clutch ($250) while I was at it. Add in a rear main seal to the engine, and labor to have this all done (I can't where I live), and it's a roughly $2,000 repair bill I'd need at some point. Eventually my battery will go, and that will be $1400 + shipping, for a grand total of around $3700. The replacement batteries don't tend to last more than ~5 years, so I could go with Balto's small turbo instead for ~$2000 give or take (just guessing here) but I'd still need to fix the transmission. That's a hard sell for a drivetrain approaching 250k miles.

I just sold my used hybrid battery for $800. Once I pull engine and transmission, I'll do the synchro fix in the tranny myself and probably sell it for $5-600. I imagine I'll be able to get $100-250 for a good working catalyst. Maybe $2-300 for the engine, another $100 for a set of good engine mounts, and probably no less than $200 for other miscellaneous bits I pull out of the back of the car. That comes out to around ~$2000 from selling the guts of the car. If I kept the K swap under $6,000-$6,500, I'd actually be coming out ahead - and I easily could with the right selection of bargain bin parts.

That said, I'm up for spending a little more.

I've set aside 10k, though I'm hoping to keep it under 8, so I'm thinking about this as a $2,000 "upgrade". As far as livability/economy/fun:

I'm putting a 200HP motor in a <2000lb car. It's going to be fun regardless.

I'm spending more than the cost of the engine on a gear, to improve fuel economy and livability. With any luck (and a bit of tuning) I can keep my summer tank averages above 60mpg. We'll see though.

I've opted for a transmission with a magnesium case, to save 7lbs. I'm also purchasing a limited slip differential to improve winter driving, and reduce how much I shred my tires.

I'm sorely tempted to spend another $200 to make my 6th gear 1.8% taller. Might still do it, if I decide to replace the synchros in the transmission preemptively since a new gear includes synchros.

I'm going to stick with LRR tires. I may go a little bigger, but I'm not going to be fitting sticky tires on this car, ever.

By removing the hybrid system, I can gut the entire back of the car, reupholster it, and roughly double my cargo space. Might even be able to sleep in the back on road trips.

I'm holding off on any suspension upgrades. I'll see how low the front sits after the swap and decide then if I need new springs.
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Old 07-19-2018, 07:41 AM   #56 (permalink)
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Gaptooth (retired) - '00 Honda Insight
Team Honda
Gen-1 Insights
90 day: 54.26 mpg (US)

Such Fit - '07 Honda Fit Sport
90 day: 41.27 mpg (US)

Connect - '15 Ford Transit Connect XL
90 day: 23.4 mpg (US)

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As far as a CR-V transmission for AWD, that would probably double the cost. I would need to rework the entire rear suspension: remove the rear torsion beam, build a sub-frame to support a fully independent system, new spindles, brakes, the addition of axles. In order to mount this, I'd need to remove the gas tank and fabricate a new one, because it takes up the space I'd need to mount the suspension. LHT does this, but I'm afraid to ask how much it costs.



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Old 07-19-2018, 08:12 AM   #57 (permalink)
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Black and Green - '98 Honda Civic DX Coupe
Team Honda
90 day: 66.42 mpg (US)

Black and Red - '00 Nashbar Custom built eBike
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ecky View Post
... I'm putting a 200HP motor in a <2000lb car. It's going to be fun regardless.
So true, and it is 0.25 Cd and rought 20 sqft frontal area it will have a really low CdA and therefore effectively have maybe 10 more hp available at 70mph than any MINI.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ecky View Post
... I'm sorely tempted to spend another $200 to make my 6th gear 1.8% taller. ...
I like it. Downshift against that MINI.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ecky View Post
I'm going to stick with LRR tires. I may go a little bigger, but I'm not going to be fitting sticky tires on this car, ever.
Maybe 2 more HP at 70 MPH against that MINI. You are never seriously gonna need super sticky tires on a car that is not racing. LRR will have plenty traction for everyday needs.

This is going to be a really fun ride.
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See my car's mod & maintenance thread and my electric bicycle's thread for ongoing projects. I will rebuild Black and Green over decades as parts die, until it becomes a different car of roughly the same shape and color. My minimum fuel economy goal is 55 mpg while averaging posted speed limits. I generally top 60 mpg. See also my Honda manual transmission specs thread.



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Old 07-19-2018, 09:28 AM   #58 (permalink)
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Gaptooth (retired) - '00 Honda Insight
Team Honda
Gen-1 Insights
90 day: 54.26 mpg (US)

Such Fit - '07 Honda Fit Sport
90 day: 41.27 mpg (US)

Connect - '15 Ford Transit Connect XL
90 day: 23.4 mpg (US)

K-sight - '00 Honda K-sight
Team Honda
90 day: 45.37 mpg (US)
Thanks: 1,831
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Some fun facts:

TSX OEM flywheel weight: 18.2lbs
Insight flywheel weight: 13lbs + IMA motor mass
RSX Type R flywheel: ~10lbs

Insight rim weight: 11lbs
TSX rim weight: 21lbs

RE92 tire weight: 13lbs
TSX tire weight: ~23lbs

Compared with a TSX, I'm reducing rotating mass at the flywheel by 45% (8.2lbs), and at the tires by 80lbs, which is also almost exactly 45%.

The TSX weighs around 3300lbs. The Insight with TSX engine will likely be around 1950lbs (maybe a bit less). This is a 41% reduction in weight. If I can get it down a little bit, to its stock weight (might be possible after gutting the back, lightweight battery), it would also be an approximate 45% weight reduction.
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Old 07-20-2018, 06:29 PM   #59 (permalink)
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IGL - '04 Saturn Ion
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90 day: 56.19 mpg (US)

grayOS (personal use) - '19 Mitsubishi Outlander Sport ES
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Hmmm... 45% lighter all around... and don’t listen to they who preach the AWD, it’s simply not needed under 350whp... limited slip should help lots, and a wider tire should help more... if you raced the thing, something like an R888 tire should help it hook up really nice
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Old 07-20-2018, 10:16 PM   #60 (permalink)
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Gaptooth (retired) - '00 Honda Insight
Team Honda
Gen-1 Insights
90 day: 54.26 mpg (US)

Such Fit - '07 Honda Fit Sport
90 day: 41.27 mpg (US)

Connect - '15 Ford Transit Connect XL
90 day: 23.4 mpg (US)

K-sight - '00 Honda K-sight
Team Honda
90 day: 45.37 mpg (US)
Thanks: 1,831
Thanked 1,702 Times in 1,090 Posts
Some goodies have arrived.


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