Honda Insight w/Acura TSX engine - Ecomodding

[Ecky]

Originally Posted by California98Civic

Is that Tom Mix bar named for the early Western movie star? He died in a car wreck in 1940 in which a metal suitcase in his backseat of his Cord Phaeton struck him in the head and broke his neck.

Geez... better keep it.

Yeah, there was an overhead luggage rack and the back of the seats had no head rests, so the suitcase slid off the rack and struck him in the back of the head.

I don't think the bar is formally called a "Tom Mix bar", but rather that it's a nickname that was given to it.

Personally, I don't foresee something at foot level behind my seats striking me in the back of the head. I could potentially see more side impact crumple without the crossbeam, but it's really not a very big bar. I'd say it's 1/8" aluminum at best.

[Baltothewolf]

Removing that cross bar could cost you your life. I met this insight owner at a Del Taco when I used to work at the shop (cutting a long story short here) anyway, he ended up pulling out in front of a speeding motorcycle, and got T boned almost exactly where that bar is, just a hair more front. The bar prevented the vehicle from crumpling in at that spot, which definitely would have ended that man's life. I wish I still had the pictures, but it was a long time, and two phones ago.

[Ecky]

Originally Posted by Baltothewolf

Removing that cross bar could cost you your life. I met this insight owner at a Del Taco when I used to work at the shop (cutting a long story short here) anyway, he ended up pulling out in front of a speeding motorcycle, and got T boned almost exactly where that bar is, just a hair more front. The bar prevented the vehicle from crumpling in at that spot, which definitely would have ended that man's life. I wish I still had the pictures, but it was a long time, and two phones ago.

I would appreciate those pictures, if you can find them. Just looking at the numbers - approximately 2.6 car accident deaths per 100,000 in my state (per year) - it's hard to get excited about in a very personal way. To me it sounds like I'm far more likely to die of breathing in exhaust from other vehicles on the road. We're talking thousandths of a percent here, and I'm a pretty defensive driver to begin with.

Going a little further, 72% of those 2.6 per 100,000 had alcohol in their blood, and I don't drink. Approximately half weren't wearing their seatbelt, which I always do. And, only maybe half of those were side impact. So in perhaps over-simplifying math, it works out to about 0.182 deaths / 100,000, or a 0.00018% chance of me being killed (statistically) from a side impact in a given year, assuming I'm about as careless as the average driver. Maybe I increase that by half or more by removing the bar, or maybe not.

For comparison, 1 in 3 people will be diagnosed with cancer in their lives. Heart disease kills 1 in 4 men, and killed both my father and grandfather in their 50's. Their diets were poor. I think if I were to focus my efforts somewhere, eating better than they did and making sure I put on my seatbelt every time I get in my car might be a better use of my time than worrying about that bar.

EDIT: I'm considering relocating the bar a little lower, rather than removing it.

[Baltothewolf]

Yea sadly I don't have those pictures anymore. I mean you do whatever you think is best, it's your car, I just don't want to see you die because you removed something that wasn't supposed to be removed.

[redpoint5]

My opinion on safety is that any cager is going to be more safe than a motorcycle. We're talking vanishingly unlikely scenarios that would result in dramatic injury.

Diet and exercise is what I recommend focusing on from a safety perspective.

[Ecky]

Originally Posted by Baltothewolf

Yea sadly I don't have those pictures anymore. I mean you do whatever you think is best, it's your car, I just don't want to see you die because you removed something that wasn't supposed to be removed.

I'll see about putting a thick piece of angle with braces at the ends about where the bar was, but a little lower, so I can have a flat deck.

Ordered ~40 square feet of sound dampening butyl rubber.

Thinking of relocating the fuel fill lines as well.

[Ecky]

Looks like I can roughly quantify lean burn's impact on fuel economy.

On my morning commute, which is ~11 miles and maybe half of it I can run lean, my most common readout is 73.3mpg. Sometimes I can manage a little higher, but I get this exact amount suspiciously frequently.

After installing an arduino to spoof the IMA signals and get the CEL to shut off, I lost lean burn. Conditions were almost ideal this morning on my way to work, it likely would have been a 75-80mpg day. I pulled in to the parking lot with 68.8mpg on the meter. So, I'm going to call it very approximately 10% in mixed driving.

[MetroMPG]

If I recall, in my typical usage (mainly secondary highway driving on very lean-burn friendly routes with extensive aero mods), it was more like a ~33% increase, from ~75 mpg to ~100+ mpg.

[Ecky]

Originally Posted by MetroMPG

If I recally, in my typical usage (mainly secondary highway driving on very lean-burn friendly routes with extensive aero mods), it was more like a ~33% increase, from ~75 mpg to ~100+ mpg.

I find I'm still able to cruise at ~85mpg where I would be getting 90-100mpg with lean burn enabled, but I'm sure the delta would be larger, the larger the percent of cruising on level ground. I may do further testing though.

[Baltothewolf]

Originally Posted by Ecky

Looks like I can roughly quantify lean burn's impact on fuel economy.

On my morning commute, which is ~11 miles and maybe half of it I can run lean, my most common readout is 73.3mpg. Sometimes I can manage a little higher, but I get this exact amount suspiciously frequently.

After installing an arduino to spoof the IMA signals and get the CEL to shut off, I lost lean burn. Conditions were almost ideal this morning on my way to work, it likely would have been a 75-80mpg day. I pulled in to the parking lot with 68.8mpg on the meter. So, I'm going to call it very approximately 10% in mixed driving.

Are you sure you have the most recent code for the arduino? When I had it in my car I lost lean burn until I went to the most recent code.