A New 'Take' On Hot Air Intakes

[Funny]

Originally Posted by brucepick

If you're going to work with WAI or HAI get some kind of intake air temperature monitoring (I did, for $10). You want to know the outside temperature and the temp of air going to the engine.

Thanks for the input Bruce, I do have a Scangauge I. I just implemented a grill and radiator block this evening and took her for a spin. The outside air temp was 50*F and the intake temps after warm-up were 63*F. The problem I was having was the coolant temps were bouncing between 207*F and 198*F (the radiator fans were going on and off. I could hear those mileage robbing beasts going a few times when I was at stop signs.) I still got 45.9 MPG on the trip . I think if I do a partial grill block, it will solve that issue, at least for the most part (she won't fluctuate as much).

[cfg83]

Funny -

Originally Posted by Funny

I understand what your saying, but the HAI (In Theory) would be self maintaining, and linear in its temperature range after the initial warm-up. As the oil heats up, it would be perpetually cooled (I use this as a relative term, because the outside air temps will always we colder than the oil temperature, unless I'm driving through fire ), by the incoming air, thus allowing for a greater capacity for grill blocks, high temperature thermostats (still have yet to find one for the Lemon) and other such thermal efficiency modifications.

As a research and development technician, it's my job to look at all aspects of the experiment before performing it to see if my hypothesis is indeed correct. It's one of my flaws I think, not being spontaneous. I also don't want to ___ up my car .

I agree, a self-regulating "passive" solution is always better. Nothing to break (or melt, ).

Since I am not a car-person by experience, I am super-cautious too. I only have my daily driver, so I can't afford to ____ up either.

In terms of high-temp thermostat, I think this is an option for you :

High Range Adjustable Temperature Switch with LCD
http://www.jaycar.com.au/productView...=&SUBCATID=347

- Measures to an incredible 1200 degrees celsius
- Switch devices on or off at a set temperature
- Digital readout
- Use it to:
Display any car temperature: oil, exhaust gas, coolant, intake air, brakes, etc
Trigger alarms, warning lights, fans, etc, at a selectable temperature.

Refer: Performance Electronics for Cars - Silicon Chip Publications
Heat can be a major problem with any car, especially modified and performance cars. the more power, the more heat, so you need to ensure you have adequate cooling systems in place. This temperature switch can be set anywhere up to 1200 degrees celsius, so it is extremely versatile. The relay can be used to trigger an extra thermo fan on an intercooler, mount a sensor near your turbo manifold and trigger water spray cooling, or a simple buzzer or light to warn you of a high temperature. The LCD, which can easily be dash mounted, displays the temperature all the time. kit supplied with a quality solder masked PCB with overlay, LCD panel, temperature probe and all electronic components. Probe does NOT have isolated case. Kit requires probe with insulated case, if mounted to common ground.

This could be used to monitor engine temps.

CarloSW2

[Funny]

Originally Posted by cfg83

Funny -
I agree, a self-regulating "passive" solution is always better. Nothing to break (or melt, ).

Since I am not a car-person by experience, I am super-cautious too. I only have my daily driver, so I can't afford to ____ up either.

Thanks, mine is a daily driver too and I believe in passive solutions, with the exception of transmissions (got to have a manual!) .

Originally Posted by cfg83

In terms of high-temp thermostat, I think this is an option for you :
High Range Adjustable Temperature Switch with LCD
http://www.jaycar.com.au/productView...=&SUBCATID=347



This could be used to monitor engine temps.

CarloSW2

By thermostat, I meant in-line with the radiator hose to regulate the coolant flow. This is an interesting idea though, having a temperature of the exhaust manifold or even the oil cooler in the HAI would be real nice, especially If I do make that into a mod on my vehicle. That would tell me how consistent the oil temperature is. I'm making note of the site right now for later use . I have a Scangauge I to take care of my internal monitoring. If you haven't picked one up yet, they are by far the best $139-169 bucks you can spend on instrumentation/diagnostics.

[Duffman]

Why not use engine coolant? Tee into the heater hose at the water pump and throtle the flow with the same type of controls that you use on your existing heater. Water temp is much more stable than oil temp and would be easier to control I would think.

[Funny]

I had already thought about coolant, Duffman, as the coolant in the average auto is about 200-220*F. I like your idea though. Thermal efficiency of a heater core or oil cooler is not 100% by any stretch, and the addition of other pipes that would lose heat and more coolant to warm up seemed to me to be the deciding factor against that.

That is why was searching for a "warmer" heat source. I thought about the exhaust system, as that is a huge waste of potential energy, but after further inspection of my car, I realized how difficult it would be to make and mount a system that wouldn't lose most of its heat from the back of my engine bay to the front (my engine's turned 180 degrees from you Honda guys )

I got this idea a few weeks ago, when I was browsing an online catalog that sold battery relocation kits. I wanted to even out the weight distribution in my car, so naturally, I sought to move one of the heaviest objects to the trunk. Then I realized all the unused space up front could be used to engineer a more fuel efficient air intake.

In the same online catalog, I found oil filter relocation kits and oil coolers. A gear in my mind must have up shifted and that's where I got the idea of using the oil for a heat source. Often at upwards of 250-300*F (not sure of the exact temps, please correct if I'm wrong), and the oil being a fluid so it was more likely to hold energy longer, it seemed to me to be an ideal solution to "where to get the heat?"

The other reason I wanted to get the oil filter relocation kit was because of the nature of the Rolling Lemons current filter to be high and recessed. I just wanted to make it easier to do oil changes .

Maybe I should make a hybrid Oil/Coolant based HAI . That seems like more of an engineering challenge (nightmare) to me.

[Duffman]

The thing of it is, oil temp is very dependent on the engine load, so at low load when you can use more heat you have less and at high load when more heat is in the oil, engine pinging may be a problem. Its true that engine coolant behaves the same way but it has a thermostat that partitions the engine coolant from its reservoir (radiator) holding it at a much more consistent temp. I would think it would get hotter faster as well with coolant.

One thing that I don’t like about the oil idea is you go allot farther on a coolant leak than you will on an oil leak. The potential for catastrophic failure from a busted oil line is a lot higher when you are low on oil than low on coolant.

[Funny]

Originally Posted by Duffman

The thing of it is, oil temp is very dependent on the engine load, so at low load when you can use more heat you have less and at high load when more heat is in the oil, engine pinging may be a problem. Its true that engine coolant behaves the same way but it has a thermostat that partitions the engine coolant from its reservoir (radiator) holding it at a much more consistent temp. I would think it would get hotter faster as well with coolant.

One thing that I don’t like about the oil idea is you go allot farther on a coolant leak than you will on an oil leak. The potential for catastrophic failure from a busted oil line is a lot higher when you are low on oil than low on coolant.

You make a lot of good points .
I think I'm just a little leary of playing with the coolant system, but I think I can adapt this idea to work with coolant.
I just wanted to use a higher temperature fluid (oil) because I can't find a high-temp thermostat for a 2002 Corolla anywhere. There is also the issue of making a system with a thermostat for the HAI so that the heater core/oil cooler doesn't overheat, stays at a stable temperature, and doesn't affect the drivability of the car. Maybe now I can make a system that uses the Prius Radiator Theremos . I may be overthinking this just a bit. Please pull me back down to earth.

[Duffman]

Maybe someone can jump in here and help on the oil temp issue but I dont think it will be any hotter than the coolant temp under moderate loads.

If you go with the coolant method, thermostatic controls are not an issue, it will not get higher than your coolant thermostat temp and you can use a heater control slider to control your valve to the HAI heat exchanger.

I am a little puzzled that you say you dont want to mess with the coolant side. Where are you going to tap into for the oil for a high pressure oil supply? For a coolant system I would buy one of those tees that you get to flush your coolant and just tie it in paralell with your heater core. For the heat exchanger I would just use a heater core. I dont for see more than $30 on parts if you get a used valve, heater core and new hose.

[LostCause]

I believe oil temperatures hover around 180-220 degrees fahrenheit. I'm pretty sure oil viscosities are measures at 100 degrees celsius (212 F).

I wouldn't tap into the oil line simply because lowering the oil temperature is going to increase the viscosity of the oil. The coolant line setup would work well, but at the cost of added complexity.

I would just get an aluminum heater duct, route it from the front of your car, to the rear of the engine (touching the headers), and back to the throttle body. Your engine is reversed, but it should still be doable.

You could also create a heat muff through a similar method, but instead leave the heat output angled towards the throttle body rather then directly attached...no need to create a throttle restriction.

- LostCause