PHEV Prius in 2011 (hybrid with optional plug-in 14 mile electric range)

[bennelson]

In fact, the software already HAS been hacked!
A couple of guys in Chicago (the Ewerts) who have done plenty of electronics design on PHEV conversions rigged up a Prius to go freeway speed on EV only.

Lots of people expressed concerns about damaging the car, etc. By having Toyota come out with a high-speed EV only mode, it seems to confirm that it is totally doable in a safe way.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8y5n32p6u3Y

roflwaffle: Won't vehicles like the Leaf have a pretty good warranty? I would think they would need to so that people wouldn't have worries of the batteries. Of course the Leaf is going to have a 5 year battery lease.

I don't know what kind of warranty the VOLT is supposed to have.

[NeilBlanchard]

The expected lifespan of the iMiEV batteries is 10 years.

[MetroMPG]

It's important to understand what "lifespan" means in terms of industry standards as well.

By several definitions I've read, a battery is considered worn out when its capacity is 80% of new.

(I don't know what the auto industry standard is for EV packs.)

So barring a cell failure that disables the pack, you can keep on using it past the due date as long as it continues to meet your range requirements.

Some observers expect to see a new industry spring up: repurposing "dead" EV batteries that still have a lot of life left in them, for other non-auto applications.

[roflwaffle]

Originally Posted by bennelson

roflwaffle: Won't vehicles like the Leaf have a pretty good warranty? I would think they would need to so that people wouldn't have worries of the batteries. Of course the Leaf is going to have a 5 year battery lease.

I don't know what kind of warranty the VOLT is supposed to have.

I dunno what kind of pack warranty the Leaf is going to have, and if it's leased I suppose it doesn't matter, but the Volt has a 10 year 150k miles warranty or an 8 year 100k mile warranty depending on which state it's sold in like any other hybrid AFAIK, which is why GM is only allowing the pack to be cycled shallowly even though it could probably do 70-80 miles new. That way the pack will have to get to 50% capacity before the 40 mile range starts to take a hit. Shallow cycles also allow more energy storage before the pack reaches a certain capacity level, at least for the cells GM is using.

[rgathright]

Originally Posted by MetroMPG

It's important to understand what "lifespan" means in terms of industry standards as well.

By several definitions I've read, a battery is considered worn out when its capacity is 80% of new.

(I don't know what the auto industry standard is for EV packs.)

So barring a cell failure that disables the pack, you can keep on using it past the due date as long as it continues to meet your range requirements.

Some observers expect to see a new industry spring up: repurposing "dead" EV batteries that still have a lot of life left in them, for other non-auto applications.

Your discussion seems focused on the lifespan of these batteries under ideal conditions. Which, the members of this forum are all concerned about. MetroMPG, I would be happy to take your 80% used EV batteries anytime.

However, in the real world, where people drive like maniacs on their cel-phones and cut each other off just to get to McDonalds, PHEV Prius owners are going to drain their batteries fast and leave them uncharged for weeks.

For example: I have never bought a replacement laptop battery for myself. Never. While on the other hand, I buy laptop batteries for friends and company employees all day. They all have the sad story that they forgot to bring their charger on vacation or at the business meeting.

The reason we had all had to wait for PHEV's is because the automobile manufacturer's had to design protective logic into the battery banks on their cars. If Toyota releases this PHEV and we as Americans start filing lawsuits over dead batteries in the first year, you can kiss EV's goodbye... forever.

[Daox]

There needs to be education done when purchasing the car is all. Along with that, just have them sign a waiver that says they went through training and understand how to use their new vehicle.

[tf4624]

ha slow people got to have it already 150 mile range

[rgathright]

Originally Posted by tf4624

ha slow people got to have it already 150 mile range

Has anyone heard about any preorder opportunities for the 2011 Toyota Prius?

[RobertSmalls]

I think that would be premature. Barring any delays, it's going to be the 2012 PHEV Prius in calendar year 2011. Pricing has not yet been announced.

[NeilBlanchard]

Also, the strange thing we have learned about this car is that it has 3 parts to the battery (4kWh total? 5?) and only 1.6kWh of it can be charged by the regenerative braking. The other two parts are only charged by the plug...