Prius versus G1 Insight

[Xist]

Originally Posted by jamesqf

Repair costs have been negligible: other than normal maintenance items, in 10 years I think I've replaced an O2 sensor and an EGR valve. I do take the battery out and rebalance it every year or two, but than doesn't cost anything but a bit of time.

Right now I feel like I only drive Bacon to the shop and back.

I have spent more on repairs than gas, as well as my "service plan." Between the plan that doesn't do anything and repairs, my car has cost 50% more.

Well, enjoy!

[RedDevil]

Originally Posted by Xist

(...) I have told people that Toyota copied the Insight, but I looked up when each was released in Japan and was confused, the Prius came out in Japan two years earlier, but you are right, the first Insight-shaped one was the 2,004 model. (...)

Like so many rules there are exceptions to it...

This is definitely a Prius shape

[IamIan]

Originally Posted by Xist

So, which has a better hybrid system, the Toyota or the Honda?

The correct answer = It varies with conditions.
There is no one better option that beats the other in all conditions.

Also ... it would be more accurate to say the Gen1 Insight as a far less useful & far less efficient EV / battery only mode ... to say it has no EV ( battery only ) Ability , is technically incorrect.

Originally Posted by Xist

Negative.

Sorry to break it to you ... but some_other_dave is correct.

Even with an additional specially designed for NoX catalytic converter the Lean Burn enabled Gen1 Insight produces more NoX than the Non-Lean Burn Enables Gen1 Insight.

Lean Burn is more energy efficient ... but produces more smog producing compounds ( such as NoX ).

Originally Posted by Xist

So, nobody clarified my misunderstanding:

Two catalysts sounds much better than two catalytic converters!

Insight owners, have some cake.

Eat it! Eat it and like it!

Actually it is 2 catalytic converts ... between them both there are two catalysts ... and there is also a 3rd piece involved ... the NoX catalytic converter also has a NoX storage mechanism to store surplus NoX until it can later ( outside of Lean Burn ) catalyze it.... but even with that ... it still will produce more smog emissions ( like NoX ).

[Xist]

IamIan, I will ignore you, because you disagree with what I want to believe, but can we still be friends?

[hawk2100n]

Originally Posted by IamIan

Actually it is 2 catalytic converts ... between them both there are two catalysts ... and there is also a 3rd piece involved ... the NoX catalytic converter also has a NoX storage mechanism to store surplus NoX until it can later ( outside of Lean Burn ) catalyze it.... but even with that ... it still will produce more smog emissions ( like NoX ).

A catalyst is a catalytic converter. However you are correct in that lean burn performs worse from an emissions standpoint. That's why Civic VX models from CA/CARB states don't have lean burn. They wouldn't meet their more stringent emissions standards.

[jamesqf]

Originally Posted by hawk2100n

A catalyst is a catalytic converter.

Strictly speaking, a catalytic converter is a device, which could have any number of different catalysts in it.

However you are correct in that lean burn performs worse from an emissions standpoint.

That all depends on what importance you assign to different emissions. It's higher in NOx (which really matters only in densely-populated areas), but considerably lower in HC, CO, and - most importantly - CO2.

[Xist]

Doesn't nitrous oxide induce happiness?

[IamIan]

Originally Posted by Xist

IamIan, I will ignore you, because you disagree with what I want to believe, but can we still be friends?

I don't know you well enough yet to justify my use of the label "Friends" ... I don't hand out that label casually... only time will tell.

[Xist]

Originally Posted by IamIan

I don't know you well enough yet to justify my use of the label "Friends" ... I don't hand out that label casually... only time will tell.

Yes, after I posted I thought of a far less weird way of posting that, but hopefully was actually trying to study. Of course, I completely forget what it was.

For the record, "choosing to ignore you" was a joke, since that seems to be what many people do, but they certainly do not admit to it!

[AJI]

Curious thread.

"Which is better?"... that rather depends on what you wish to do with them. A modern Prius will produce generally lower emissions, as it has a decade of extra refining and tweaking. Plus, it'll have a decade less wear and tear.

The Insight has massive potential, for those who can extract it. It's very light and quite aero-efficient, so doesn't need much effort to get moving and doesn't need a great deal of effort to maintain a cruising speed.

Subjectively, the Insight is also the more fun and looks much cooler. Objectively, the Prius is more practical.

Back in the late 90s, my ball would be in the Insight's court over which was better - on gas mileage alone, a gen-1 Insight makes a gen-1 Prius look a bit silly, even if you can't toddle around in EV mode like you can in the Prius.

Originally Posted by RedDevil

I have to correct myself, the Prius C is not called Yaris over here but Yaris Hybrid, and I believe it does indeed have completely incomparably different taillights.

To clarify, the Prius C and Yaris Hybrid have the same powertrain, but they differ in far more than just tail lights. I suspect they're on a similar platform, but at the end of the day the Prius C is a Prius and the Yaris Hybrid is a Yaris - different exterior, interior, packaging, styling, name...

As a bit of a journo I went on the European launch of the Yaris Hybrid. Very nice little car. Apparently, Toyota chose to sell a small, Yaris-based Hybrid in Europe because the Yaris sells much better in Europe than the Prius does. In the U.S and Japan, the Prius name carries much more weight, so a downsized Prius is the more logical option (that said, the C is called the Aqua in Japan).

Their decision appears to be vindicated, at least in Europe, as I recall reading that Yaris Hybrid sales make up around 40% of all Yaris sales. Not bad going.