Question about braking for turns while hypermiling.

[Shaneajanderson]

Originally Posted by Vman455

I drive 57 all the time, and I've driven 29 through ND. I've driven across most of the country, and IMO the most boring stretch of interstate is I-90 across southern Minnesota, hands down.

I haven't driven that through MN, though southern MN I'm sure is pretty comparable to Eastern ND

[mpg_numbers_guy]

Originally Posted by Shaneajanderson

Illinois isn't nearly as boring as driving I29 through North Dakota. Other than where it goes over one railroad, and one spot it goes over the other highway instead of having a normal overpass, and a couple road crossings in Fargo there is literally not a single hill to be seen for the entire length of the state on that road. The Agassiz basin is FLAT

Originally Posted by Vman455

I drive 57 all the time, and I've driven 29 through ND. I've driven across most of the country, and IMO the most boring stretch of interstate is I-90 across southern Minnesota, hands down.

I'll give in, as I haven't driven either of those other roads lol. I've been to 21 or 22 states, but I haven't been to the northwest at all yet, although I'd love to someday.

I-57 is pretty much just flat with fields all around you, and maybe a wind turbine or two in the horizon.

Tennessee, Texas, and especially California have some of my favorite roads. Virginia is pretty, but it's too hilly and my car doesn't like hills, so it distracts from the scenery.

[Shaneajanderson]

Originally Posted by mpg_numbers_guy

I'll give in, as I haven't driven either of those other roads lol. I've been to 21 or 22 states, but I haven't been to the northwest at all yet, although I'd love to someday.

I-57 is pretty much just flat with fields all around you, and maybe a wind turbine or two in the horizon.

Tennessee, Texas, and especially California have some of my favorite roads. Virginia is pretty, but it's too hilly and my car doesn't like hills, so it distracts from the scenery.

See I like the hills, though when I was down in Indiana/Kentucky a couple years ago we were driving our caravan, long before I had thoughts about hyper milling. Which is rather ironic because for that trip gas was right around $4/gallon. I don't know that I'd enjoy the drive as much in my Geo, but a manual car with a little sportiness too it would be fun in the twisties.

Altogether ND has a lot of really boring drives, although Roosevelt Park is a nice drive, and a lot of good scenery down in that corner of the state.

[mpg_numbers_guy]

Originally Posted by Shaneajanderson

See I like the hills, though when I was down in Indiana/Kentucky a couple years ago we were driving our caravan, long before I had thoughts about hyper milling. Which is rather ironic because for that trip gas was right around $4/gallon. I don't know that I'd enjoy the drive as much in my Geo, but a manual car with a little sportiness too it would be fun in the twisties.

Altogether ND has a lot of really boring drives, although Roosevelt Park is a nice drive, and a lot of good scenery down in that corner of the state.

Oh, don't get me wrong on this, I love driving back roads with hills and turns and such, especially going downhill leaving the car in 2nd and just riding the curves. It's the long, extended uphill climbs on the interstate that bug me a bit lol. Virginia has some really pretty hilly back roads with gorgeous scenery.

The Geo would probably be more fun through the twisties than a large Caravan; my Insight is probably pretty comparable to your Metro int terms of handling, and although it's no Civic or Miata, it is definitely more fun through the curves than a Prius or minivan on the same road.

Have you taken any longer drives in the Metro yet?

[Shaneajanderson]

Originally Posted by mpg_numbers_guy

Oh, don't get me wrong on this, I love driving back roads with hills and turns and such, especially going downhill leaving the car in 2nd and just riding the curves. It's the long, extended uphill climbs on the interstate that bug me a bit lol. Virginia has some really pretty hilly back roads with gorgeous scenery.

The Geo would probably be more fun through the twisties than a large Caravan; my Insight is probably pretty comparable to your Metro int terms of handling, and although it's no Civic or Miata, it is definitely more fun through the curves than a Prius or minivan on the same road.

Have you taken any longer drives in the Metro yet?

A two and a half hour drive up to our church camp. Anywhere further than that I go with my family so we take the van instead. My Geo exists solely for the sake of my commute, the 1 or 2 trips a year I take elsewhere having it is just a bonus. I always used to just drive my pickup on those trips because I couldn't justify the extra $500 a year in costs to have a car to save me $40 in gas.

[slowmover]

Braking is to be minimized both in application pressure AND duration.

How long the brakes last is a direct reading of operator skill. Operator skill is to both reliability & longevity where component life is reflective of overall vehicle life.

Overall vehicle life IS Economy. MPG is just a subset reading.

Road strategy involves tactics of slowing for hills and turns (include blind curves). HOW MUCH one reduces speed — to be able to accelerate away from the turn apex is skill and experience. In short, new habits at the wheel.

I note that we all have two obstacles:

1). The 16-year old still at the wheel.

2). Being “out of synch” with other traffic.

The second is easiest. Drive like “them” and you drive like a literal retard.

The first is harder. Any new habits will take 13-weeks (calendar quarter) to become a new norm. Only change things you’re willing to make permanent. And no deviations (Two AM in the morning isn’t an exception; etc).

This reminder about brake life is DIRECTLY to reading tire life. If you MUST rotate tires, something is already wrong. I go past 100k on pickup tires and MAYBE rotate once.

Drive as if tires will never again be available to you.

The total time through a turn is what is at question. The retards won’t slow even when things are dangerous. Aggravating them is part of the fun. Especially as once at the curve or turns apex I could choose to out-accelerate them all and leave them in the dust (and sometimes do in order to change lanes out ahead).

Lane position and management of over-taking traffic are the skill development in getting ready for a curve, a turn or a downhill descent.

There’s no such thing as TOO SLOW in a descent. It’s a matter of DEGREE & DURATION in using the brake pedal like the throttle.

Load the vehicle to maximum. Become VERY SMOOTH in these matters at GVWR. Afterwards, useless gas-wasting solo driving is easy if you always drive as it loaded to maximum

At a quarter-million miles my pickup will have used two sets of tires and had one brake job.

The index is always relating these operational costs to the cost-per-mile. It’s vanishingly small in this example, and another of each isn’t much of a burden over total length of ownership.

The point is to have done the most work with the least fuel. Brakes & Tires are that pair of gauges. Assuming the desire for high mpg, this pair reflects that VERY well.

I’d hesitate in training someone to act as if they’ll run out of fuel (versus the thought about no more tires) as vehicle controls SHOULD be available in full capacity at all times. The introduction of timidity is not the intent.

But for the boy racers around here, “timidity” is not what you think it to be. The agressiveness with which I can horse this semi-tractor/trailer through traffic (lane changes, many at once, so to speak) isn’t evident from the outside. It’s almost like running in reverse against other traffic. Timing & control.

Until you car owners are burdened by your heavy, swaying, loaded-to-the -gills family vehicle and are good at it what you & your car can do is partially or largely hidden from you. All done safely.

EM is a fine site because you ALREADY have a desire to be better. Many or most of you soon learn that vehicle mods are a dead-end. Limited.

What DOESNT change (and is a helluva lot more fun to solve) are the constant DYNAMIC relationships between man & car, car & traffic etc.

In big trucks it’s: road, load, traffic & weather.

The spur is how easily you can be killed. Skill or experience don’t matter nearly so much as BEST HABITS. Safety & FE track the same, and the former always has precedence.

How to make a descent, both literally and figuratively, starts far in advance.

.

[pete c]

Originally Posted by Shaneajanderson

Keep in mind that hypermiling always comes secondary to safety. You may be able to pull that corner at speed when it's sunny, 75, with no wind. But what happens if it rained while you were at work and you don't realize that bit of ground is still wet. Or what if someone drove over that piece of ground and their car leaked some oil there? What if there's a little bit of sand/gravel on that stretch?

I would use the transmission to slow down as much as you can (if you have a manual), but definitely don't take corners at top speed, the little bit of fuel you save doing that won't nearly cover the cost if you wipe out just one time.

I agree about safety. I never take that turn at anything remotely approaching 10/10ths. But I am going fast enough that I can feel the tire scrub.

As for starting the plunge at the lowest possible speed, it is at the end of a long downhill that flatens out for a good half mile, so I am typically in DFCO, 4th gear, a bit under 30, which is just above idle. If I slowed more, I would be idling or in 3rd in DFCO. I do not EOC as I have been told that it isn't a good thing for CR TDIs.

As for driving hills in general, this is one thing I really like about the TDI. It is amazing how well this thing pulls hills without a downshift. The other day I was climbing a moderately steep long interstate grade in 6th. There was a fair bit of traffic, so my eyes were on it, rather than the speedo. Midway up the hill, I notice I am passing cars at a pretty good clip, so I look down at the speedo, expecting to see something under 70. I was at about 82.

I've never had a car before where I thought I might be ticketed simply because I wasn't paying attention to speed, while climbing a hill.

[Fat Charlie]

If 4th is just above idle and isn't helping slow you, downshift early enough so that 3rd helps you on the big downhill but not so soon as to slow down your beginning.

You're not committed to any particular gear for the whole hill.