Go Back   EcoModder Forum > EcoModding > EcoModding Central
Register Now
 Register Now
 

Reply  Post New Thread
 
Submit Tools LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 10-15-2019, 10:33 AM   #1 (permalink)
Administrator
 
Daox's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Germantown, WI
Posts: 11,009

CM400E - '81 Honda CM400E
90 day: 58.68 mpg (US)

Daox's Grey Prius - '04 Toyota Prius
Team Toyota
90 day: 49.53 mpg (US)

Daox's Insight - '00 Honda Insight
90 day: 64.33 mpg (US)

Swarthy - '14 Mitsubishi Mirage DE
Mitsubishi
90 day: 56.69 mpg (US)
Thanks: 2,332
Thanked 2,409 Times in 1,457 Posts
Retaining heat use during EOC

I'm not sure about the rest of you, but around here it has sure cooled off quickly. Just last week I was going to work and it was 60F out at 7 in the morning. Today it was 34F. So, I was using my heat today. And of course with P&G you kind of loose nice warm heat after a few seconds of EOC. A few more seconds later and its not real warm at all. A bit longer and you may find yourself turning down the fan speed so it doesn't blow cold air on you. Of course, as soon as you bump start, you're jacking the fan speed back up to get the heat back! This is obnoxious to me, so I would like to fix it. Its also a detriment to defrosting when you first start driving. This causes me to run my engine more just so I can stay safe and see.

My first thought thus far is to put in a small 12V coolant pump that runs when the engine is not running. It can be put directly on the 5/8" heater core hose. There seem to be more and more small coolant pumps available as more and more hybrid and start/stop systems are put in place. You can pick one of these up for about $36 on amazon.

12V coolant pump



I'm very open to other ideas for retaining heat use with the engine off, but this seems to be the simplest I can think of.

The next step would be how to turn it on only when the engine is not running. I don't really have any thoughts on that so far, so I would love to hear you guy's thoughts on how we could do this.

Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	pump.jpg
Views:	203
Size:	23.9 KB
ID:	26993  
__________________
Current project: Adding regenerative braking to the Mirage
  Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Daox For This Useful Post:
funkhoss (11-04-2019)
Alt Today
Popular topics

Other popular topics in this forum...

   
Old 10-15-2019, 10:42 AM   #2 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
Piotrsko's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: 1826 miles WSW of Normal
Posts: 812
Thanks: 31
Thanked 198 Times in 165 Posts
On the ranger, I built a pumped tank system and use a 12v 50 amp solar panel dump heating element, but it is my primary heat /defrost source. You only need pumped storage because you can expand your coolant system. You could use a car coffee heater or two to keep your tank warm. Add a high temp thermostat and waller you're golden

Otoh, isn't being warm anti efficiency?
__________________
2000 F250 7.3 CC 20+ MPG @ 10000 #
2013 Golf tdi 47.5 mpg neutered, 1500 mi beer run
1988 Ranger EV Volt batts>> 18,000 MPG and climbing. Rag overhaul.
  Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Piotrsko For This Useful Post:
Daox (10-16-2019)
Old 10-15-2019, 12:26 PM   #3 (permalink)
Master procastinator
 
Join Date: Apr 2017
Location: Panelia, Finland
Posts: 193

Avenger - '98 Toyota Avensis 4A-FE
90 day: 35.37 mpg (US)

Sportig - '15 Kia Sportage 2.0crdi 4x4
Thanks: 62
Thanked 31 Times in 28 Posts
Hate to be that guy, but: How much is the fuel savings difference between engine off coasting and engine on coasting(maybe dfco)?
Interesting idea, still.
  Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to iikhod For This Useful Post:
Daox (10-16-2019)
Old 10-15-2019, 01:31 PM   #4 (permalink)
EcoModding Newb
 
redpoint5's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Oregon
Posts: 6,720

Acura TSX - '06 Acura TSX
90 day: 28.07 mpg (US)

Lafawnda - '01 Honda CBR600 F4i
90 day: 47.32 mpg (US)

Big Yeller - '98 Dodge Ram 2500 base
90 day: 21.82 mpg (US)

Prius Plug-in - '12 Toyota Prius Plug-in
90 day: 57.64 mpg (US)

Mazda CX-5 - '17 Mazda CX-5 Touring
90 day: 28.08 mpg (US)
Thanks: 2,205
Thanked 2,557 Times in 1,890 Posts
My first steps would be engine coolant heater so I start off in the morning with reasonably warm fluid, and a grill block. I tend to run the fan on the lowest setting unless I'm trying to defrost/clear a window because I don't like the extra noise, and it's just about as effective at warming the cabin (hotter air rather than more warm air). Then I have seat heaters which are quite effective and very economical to run.

Interesting idea with the 12v pump though.
__________________
Gas and Electric Vehicle Cost of Ownership Calculator







Give me absolute safety, or give me death!
  Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to redpoint5 For This Useful Post:
Daox (10-16-2019), slowmover (10-16-2019)
Old 10-15-2019, 02:04 PM   #5 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
Piotrsko's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: 1826 miles WSW of Normal
Posts: 812
Thanks: 31
Thanked 198 Times in 165 Posts
I was gonna go with what will this save, but it's DAOX so I figured that was unnecessary.

Another thought along redpoints line: oil filled room heater before driving. Heavier coat while driving. After all, they DIDN'T have car heaters in 1908.
__________________
2000 F250 7.3 CC 20+ MPG @ 10000 #
2013 Golf tdi 47.5 mpg neutered, 1500 mi beer run
1988 Ranger EV Volt batts>> 18,000 MPG and climbing. Rag overhaul.
  Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Piotrsko For This Useful Post:
Daox (10-16-2019)
Old 10-15-2019, 02:52 PM   #6 (permalink)
Redneck Ecomodder
 
Join Date: Feb 2019
Location: North Dakota
Posts: 437

Dent-Mobile - '99 Buick Lesabre
90 day: 22.68 mpg (US)

Red Rocket - '92 Geo Metro Base
Thanks: 11
Thanked 89 Times in 70 Posts
When I drove school bus many of them had electric recirculating pumps. The best method was to shut off the engine and turn on the recirculating pump, as it only pumped from the engine to the heater cores. The radiator cooled off very quickly and the thermostat closed, but the hot engine would heat the cab for an hour or more. The running engine kept coolant going to the radiator and would actually cool it off faster, circa 15 minutes for an idling bus engine.
__________________
  Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Shaneajanderson For This Useful Post:
Daox (10-16-2019), MetroMPG (10-17-2019)
Old 10-15-2019, 02:55 PM   #7 (permalink)
Redneck Ecomodder
 
Join Date: Feb 2019
Location: North Dakota
Posts: 437

Dent-Mobile - '99 Buick Lesabre
90 day: 22.68 mpg (US)

Red Rocket - '92 Geo Metro Base
Thanks: 11
Thanked 89 Times in 70 Posts
Sorry for the incomplete thought: the point was that your idea should work fine, though I imagine you couldn't sit and use it long term, but for 10-15 minutes it would probably stay warm, and certainly enough to take care of EOC. as for wiring, if you have a toggle kill switch, you could maybe figure a way to have the toggle disconnect your fuel injectors, and at the same time cut power to a normally closed relay that runs this little pump. Of course the pump power would have to also run through ignition, or else be manually toggled off when you shut the car off or drain the battery dead.
__________________
  Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Shaneajanderson For This Useful Post:
Daox (10-16-2019)
Old 10-15-2019, 02:56 PM   #8 (permalink)
Master procastinator
 
Join Date: Apr 2017
Location: Panelia, Finland
Posts: 193

Avenger - '98 Toyota Avensis 4A-FE
90 day: 35.37 mpg (US)

Sportig - '15 Kia Sportage 2.0crdi 4x4
Thanks: 62
Thanked 31 Times in 28 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Piotrsko View Post
I was gonna go with what will this save, but it's DAOX so I figured that was unnecessary.

Another thought along redpoints line: oil filled room heater before driving. Heavier coat while driving. After all, they DIDN'T have car heaters in 1908.
I once owned a saab 900. Bought it because the "warmest winter car ever" - reputation. Zero warm air to the cabin. So i drove around with big coat, big furhat and big warm mittens. So yeah, warmer clothing is one way to do it.

As for the circulation pump itself, you could buy it second hand even cheaper from a junk yard. Some cars have a pump like that, for circulating coolant after shutdown, if necessary for cooling. Fans also run during this time. I believe vw t4 vans have this feature? Correct me if i'm wrong.
  Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to iikhod For This Useful Post:
Daox (10-16-2019)
Old 10-15-2019, 05:02 PM   #9 (permalink)
It's all about Diesel
 
cRiPpLe_rOoStEr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Porto Alegre, Rio Grande do Sul, Brazil
Posts: 7,391
Thanks: 0
Thanked 762 Times in 673 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaneajanderson View Post
When I drove school bus many of them had electric recirculating pumps. The best method was to shut off the engine and turn on the recirculating pump, as it only pumped from the engine to the heater cores. The radiator cooled off very quickly and the thermostat closed, but the hot engine would heat the cab for an hour or more. The running engine kept coolant going to the radiator and would actually cool it off faster, circa 15 minutes for an idling bus engine.
Even though the Mirage's engine would have less heat to dissipate, I guess the proportion between engine size and interior space would lead such setup to be quite effective. As a last-case scenario, adding a small supplemental coolant heater might help somewhat.
  Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to cRiPpLe_rOoStEr For This Useful Post:
Daox (10-16-2019)
Old 10-15-2019, 05:34 PM   #10 (permalink)
Luddite
 
deluxx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2018
Location: Baltimore
Posts: 121

Green - '96 Honda Civic LX
90 day: 44.72 mpg (US)
Thanks: 85
Thanked 36 Times in 31 Posts
Great idea again Daox! I see some pre trip heaters might be good for cold mornings. Ever see one like this? Kat's 13150 1500 Watt Aluminum Circulating Tank Heater

  Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to deluxx For This Useful Post:
Daox (10-16-2019)
Reply  Post New Thread


Thread Tools




Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.5.2
All content copyright EcoModder.com