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Old 09-14-2019, 12:24 AM   #1 (permalink)
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//// TDI Prius OR TDI Corolla ? ////

Hi All,

Recently I came across a wrecked 2003 Jetta TDI and thought about getting it for the engine to do an interesting swap.

I drive doing delivery work so maximum mileage (and durability) means maximum savings.

I currently have 2 cars that can fit everything I need to haul... the smaller one being a 1996 Geo Prism (4 door rear seats removed for space) and the other being my 2003 Jetta wagon which still needs TLC.

Since my Wagon was down (soon to be fixed), I had briefly looked into getting a Toyota Prius ... they get really good mileage, have space, and use cheaper fuel to boot (yes they can be modded to handle better too .... been researching!).

Anyways, I came across a 2006 Prius with a blown engine the owner was getting rid of and the ol brain started clicking!

I think the TDI into Prius swap would be "better" mileage wise (aero and hybrid!) BUTwould be a bit harder because an adapter plate would have to be fabbed to attach the TDI to to the hybrid drive not to mention the need to change the TDI output shaft (via adapter?) to get the TDI to work.

On the other hand,

I was thinking about a TDI into an older Toyota Corolla (like my Geo Prism) something in the 2002 and before model year since the cars were pretty light back then (per my research about 2400 lbs .... this is way less weight than my Jetta Wagon which I have seen figures as high as 3200 lbs ).

My thinking is the huge weight savings could allow the engine to pull a much higher 5th gear (5th gear change) for even better fuel mileage not to mention pretty peppy performance because of the lighter weight !

My thinking on this would be to remove the running gear out of the corolla and fit in a TDI and 5 speed in its place.

This would probably be an easier swap than into a prius ....

If only the Prius were lighter, then it would be a no brainer ....

Anyways, what do you all think ?

For potential Prius install , does anybody have a schematic of the TDI engine to Transmission bolt pattern and engine output shaft specs?

Let me know what you all think .... my helper is a pretty handy guy and between we have all the tools needed to fab and tinker with just need technical assistance.

Thanks in advance for any and all help.

Andrew

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Old 09-14-2019, 04:22 AM   #2 (permalink)
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How about swapping that tdi into your jetta wagon?

Also, a prius with all the hybrid stuff removed and a tdi swap sounds interesting, in a good way. I have no idea what the law says about that kind of swap.

How much diesel costs in the usa? Here it is slightly cheaper compared to gasoline.
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Old 09-14-2019, 11:17 AM   #3 (permalink)
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Unless you're a glutton for punishment (And, most likely failure) the only reasonable swap is in to the Jetta wagon. Even that will probably be too much for anyone not at least a back yard mechanic. You'd have to be an electronics whiz and/or hacker to get the Prius hybrid system to work with it.
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Old 09-15-2019, 02:20 AM   #4 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stubby79 View Post
You'd have to be an electronics whiz and/or hacker to get the Prius hybrid system to work with it.
Ya, you won't have any issues with bolting up to the Prius' transmission because you won't be using it.

Weight savings won't make nearly as much difference in cruising mileage as aero. The Prius' aero will more than make up for its extra weight (most of which will be removed when you gut the hybrid system).

Are you looking for maximum mileage or minimum overall expense? A TDI swapped Prius would give max mileage, but I think getting a running Prius and using it as is would be cheapest. TDI into your Jetta would probably be the cheapest/best swap.
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Old 09-15-2019, 11:29 AM   #5 (permalink)
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I would do a $5000 non wrecked 2016 TDI Toyota Mirai

Newer sheet metal at not a bad auction price
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Old 09-15-2019, 03:05 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by iikhod View Post
How about swapping that tdi into your jetta wagon?

Also, a prius with all the hybrid stuff removed and a tdi swap sounds interesting, in a good way. I have no idea what the law says about that kind of swap.

How much diesel costs in the usa? Here it is slightly cheaper compared to gasoline.
Diesel is consistently above the price of regular gasohol in my area of the USA, averaging probably 50 cents per gallon or so higher for a number of years now.

When I bought a new gas-fueled 2015 Mazda3 2.0L instead of a diesel-fueled VW, I did so based on a significantly cheaper purchase price and the less complicated engine dynamics compared with today's turbocharged diesels with their emissions.

My long-term fuel-cost-only operating expense for the Mazda3 automatic are at 4.6 cents per mile, a level that is probably as good as or better than many higher-MPG diesels due to the pump price differentials.

I think a diesel is a hard case to make nowadays if you are going to keep it emission-legal.
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Old 09-18-2019, 08:53 AM   #7 (permalink)
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A tiny diesel into a Honda Insight shell would be ideal. Someone a while back even got the hybrid system working with the 1.2 TDi they swapped in, though I won’t even begin to speculate on how.
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Old 09-20-2019, 12:28 AM   #8 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ecky View Post
A tiny diesel into a Honda Insight shell would be ideal. Someone a while back even got the hybrid system working with the 1.2 TDi they swapped in, though I won’t even begin to speculate on how.
I remember this. Also haven't seen anything new about this project or the guy who did it. But anyway, considering its stock hybrid system was basically an assist instead of providing full-hybrid features, it gets me wondering if a BAS-Hybrid setup similar to what Suzuki is now applying to some Diesel-powered cars in India would achieve a similar effectiveness.
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Old 10-07-2019, 02:12 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Red face

Diesel engine on a Toyota hybrid is just plain heresy
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Old 10-08-2019, 10:43 AM   #10 (permalink)
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Swaps are wasting your time. The ALH TDI is a proven engine good for 600k miles with regular maintenance. Yes a great motor even in commercial use. Take it out of service once a year for required fixes and it will treat you to excellent service. The cars are good too, mk4 chassis VW again no problem with 600k miles if you keep up on the fixes and what needs to be done. Simple cars too.
Putting the ALH into something else is not only a technical challenge but you are also considering putting it into cars that normally do not last as long as the original vehicle. Rust is mostly the issue. Parts support another issue few think of in the long run, Japanese discontinue parts support long before the Germans do. There is also a greater community and car shows/swap meets to find stuff with German cars.
Another issue, vibration. I doubt the hybrid system will work for long dealing with the diesel vibrations. Meaning it could be done, but in 5 years the issues will be known.
Vw has a pretty good package in the 99-03 Golf and Jetta. I have several, wrenched on them for years professionally, do swap meets, we still have our 2000 we bought new and now at 400k miles. It was in daily service for 17 years before we replaced it and extremely reliable. If you go manual trans the fuel economy is very hard to beat and there is power when needed.
If you want an easy project find a mk1 Rabbit, 2000 lbs, hatchback and easy to engine swap any diesel into from the 80s to 1998. The ALH can go in, but requires some parts to make it fit (mounts). Or for a bigger car perhaps a Dasher wagon or Quantum. But those earlier cars need more constant love and maybe too much for commercial use.

My personal experience is Toyota and Honda have great cars as is, you drive them as long as you can without fixing them, never fall in love and move on when they start failing, and typically it all happens at once. About 8-10 years in regardless of miles. You see the same ones in the junkyard, all the same model year, all the same rust. Interiors never hold up well, exhaust falling off. You can pile up the miles quickly in them, but forget about keeping them 20 years. Vw will have minor issues but spread over the life not that bad, everything holds up very well.

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