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Old 02-04-2010, 04:07 PM   #11 (permalink)
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Consumer Reports would disagree with you. Toyota and Honda are neck and neck ranked for most reliable vehicles (Honda is probably above them now haha). ...
ROFL, go Honda! Did I just hear the resale value of Honda's go up?

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Old 02-04-2010, 11:45 PM   #12 (permalink)
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I drove Celicas for a decade at an average of $200 per annum for parts and depreciation. Even lived in one for two months of reliable miles.
Not many people outside of Japan realize that Toyota is the only major auto manufacturer to maintain a fairly non-denominational chapel, or shrine, as a hangout/memorial for people who die in their product. You'd think they'd put it in the manual, maybe near the seat belt section.
The old fisherman's standard engine on the NW coast was the Easthope. In the back of their manual, there were a few selections from the Bible, of interest to sailors on sinking boats, or drifting toward a lee shore. . .
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Old 02-05-2010, 03:38 AM   #13 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Daox View Post
Consumer Reports would disagree with you. Toyota and Honda are neck and neck ranked for most reliable vehicles (Honda is probably above them now haha). Domestics are a fair amount lower on the totem pole as well as most European brands. They have improved in recent year though.
Ah Consumer Reports must know everything. Like that my electric car spontaneously lights on fire and is uncontrollable or like their MPG comparisons or their crappy suggestions on home electronics that seems to break, while their lowest scoring unit lasted longer than the best

Generally I always see initial quality, that doesn't mean much. Also my experiences with foreign cars including toyota is rather mixed. I can't say they had any more or less problems but the problems usually
1. I couldn't fix
2. cost significantly more to fix
3. no used or junkyard replacements.

My 82 diesel suburban that I drove until the body fell on the ground some 25 years later (it still runs and drives but looks like crap) has only ever needed the following
1. Batteries, filters, belts, brakes, radiator flush, transmission flush
2. 3 starters
3. 2 alternators
4. bodywork (which was never done)

And I'm told the 6.2's weren't reliable.

The starters and alternators typically cost between $50-$100 to repair

Making that vehicle the most economical to run over its life including the purchase price (for me anyway) Most every other vehicle I've dealt with has needed at least 2 $500-$800 repairs during the time we had them. The worst oddly was a plymoth voyager which got hit then was useless even after repairs, then the buick with a blown motor, then the TDI volkswagon with its belts, the honda with its blasted belts, my dad had a toyota transmission fell out at 130k, also had strange electronic ghosts, my crappy dodge with its bad electronics, the suburbans we've owned never had much in the way of issues. The only crappy one is the 89 diesel I want to get road ready with its crap 700r4, but I bought it that way, should have known better.

So my experience is, all vehicles I have owned or dealt with have had some sort of issues the cheapest to run have been suburbans in terms of repair costs and initial purchase price. The 89 is still behind the honda & toyota on repair costs despite the transmission.

So its a mixed bag, likely if I had owned these things NEW I might have a different oppinion of them but as it stands I don't like electronic ghosts and I don't like foreign car timing belts and transmissions.
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Old 02-05-2010, 03:59 AM   #14 (permalink)
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Ford had something similar. In both cases it seems to more of an issue with brake "feel" as opposed to braking ability.
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Old 02-05-2010, 02:43 PM   #15 (permalink)
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I have personally had two experiences of consequence with Toyotas, both of them involving 70's vintage vehicles and both of them extremely positive from the standpoint of build quality and reliability. In addition I have family members who have long sworn by the brand. As far as I'm concerned Toyota's reputation as a maker of reliable cars is justified. I think they may have lost their way recently however. I have been hearing stories relating poorly to their reliability, and now we have these serious safety related issues.

I hope they can right their ship. And I hope I never need to use that chapel!
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Old 02-06-2010, 01:52 PM   #16 (permalink)
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And by the way, the difference between "unreliable" and "reliable" may just be whether the part that happens to fail is a recall item. The Camry may have a sticky brake pedal that the dealer can fix with a 50 cent part; my Saturn Ion has a leaky sunroof with poorly designed drains that leak water into the car (unrepairable), poor designed cigarette lighters that erupt in smoke (replacements are just as bad), front bushings that rattle (no redesigned replacement is available), a faulty ignition switch, a faulty backup switch (known issue; not redesigned), power steering linkage that knocks (known issue; not redesigned), leaky headlights and other problems. Does that mean that the Toyota is worse?
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Old 02-06-2010, 02:50 PM   #17 (permalink)
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Clev -

Yeah, when I was researching getting a used Saturn Ion, I started from the assumption of "what do I need to fix/maintain" :

Ion-Centric repair list? - SaturnFans Forums

Since the Saturn Ion is a "proto Chevy Cobalt" from my POV, they share problems and solutions.

If I had a Toyota with this problem, I wouldn't stop driving it. I'd just be happy to *know* what I need to look out for.

Also, I would look at "what's wrong with it" research as part of a new car purchase as well. The idea is to mitigate the cost of the defect. Cut it off at the pass, so to speak.

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Old 02-06-2010, 02:57 PM   #18 (permalink)
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Quote:
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Clev -

Yeah, when I was researching getting a used Saturn Ion, I started from the assumption of "what do I need to fix/maintain" :

Ion-Centric repair list? - SaturnFans Forums
Yeah, that covers most of the issues. If you can find the Ion 1 without a sunroof, that will save you a few pounds and a source of a leak. (The sunroof isn't the same shape as the roof, so it relies on the drains more than other cars.)

On the plus side, it has plenty of power (even with the 140 hp motor) and I can get 40 mpg if I didn't have that nightly climb.
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Old 02-06-2010, 02:59 PM   #19 (permalink)
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Another Prius problem is the very problematic HID headlights; which has been discussed here in the past: http://ecomodder.com/forum/showthrea...cks-10674.html
http://ecomodder.com/forum/showthrea...k-7547-25.html
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Old 02-07-2010, 12:32 AM   #20 (permalink)
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I'd still hit a 2010 Prius. And drop in my own HID kit so I can only blame myself when it burns out.

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