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Old 07-29-2010, 12:28 PM   #11 (permalink)
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Comptiger, it sounds like you have way too much displacement. A four cylinder would be more properly loaded during cruising, and you can rev it to 6000+ RPM on the rare occasion that you need lots of power. Though you may lose the ability to pass while going uphill. :-P

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Old 07-29-2010, 01:09 PM   #12 (permalink)
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I'm doing pretty well in the old ZX2. I've had a few tanks over 50mpg but only in highway driving. For me, it's easy to get over 50mpg on pure highway trips. My commute involves too much city driving, or else I would be getting 50mpg tanks commuting. Otherwise I have been pushing every closer to 50mpg on my commute with some recent mods. I believe if I can get the latest mods to work consistantly, then I can achieve 50mpg consistantly.

BTW, no EOC for me, just a nice low idle gph of 0.20, but it can range down to 0.08 This helps a lottt!
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Old 07-29-2010, 01:21 PM   #13 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RobertSmalls View Post
Comptiger, it sounds like you have way too much displacement.
and aero drag, and weight, and rolling resistance, and transmission losses...
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Old 07-29-2010, 01:35 PM   #14 (permalink)
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Yeah, this thing has a bit more engine than it needs. And, it probably burns about 1gph at idle . Then again, the 4.0 I6 isn't much better for mpg either.

The 6.8 second 0-60 is great for merging onto the highway though, when you get stuck behind the idiot doing 25 up the on-ramp and not accelerating to merge into 60 mph traffic (happens a lot around here). Just punch it, merge and settle into a nice, slow cruise in the right lane. Plus, getting on from the stop sign ramps on the Merritt (or other short ramps), it's priceless to see the face on the guy in the BMW behind you when you punch it to get on in heavy traffic and tear away in a blast of V8 noise leaving him thinking "wasn't that a Jeep?"

Plus, the 5.9 Limited is a fairly rare special edition, of which only 14,286 were sold in America (not sure if the total includes US and Canada or just US). With the bigger engine and extra power came a slightly nicer interior, slightly different exterior, electric cooling fan, heat extractor vents in the hood, better exhaust system (most people don't believe it's stock when they hear it), the need for premium gas, and only very slightly worse gas mileage than the standard V8.

I'll agree with it having lots of aero drag. It's not terrible weight-wise compared to a lot of SUVs, it weighs about 4200 pounds. Certainly not light, however. Rolling resistance is actually pretty low. Especially if I neutral coast, but even in gear if not in DFCO, I usually gain more speed than most other vehicles down hills, even doing 60 or so on the highway with all the aero drag.

I plan to try to clean up the underbody airflow a bit, and maybe eventually do a removable kammback for long trips. More aggressive use of TC lockup should help out a good bit with the transmission inefficiency.

I can also help the engine efficiency a bit with small things like upgraded fuel injectors with a better spray pattern than the crappy stock ones, giving a better burn. All told, I hope to get it up to 15mpg around town and 25 on the highway (maybe with slightly taller gears).

Fortunately, once I leave for college in a month, it will no longer be subjected to the daily commute in city traffic, etc. and I should be getting much better mpg. My normal around town grind is terrible for mpg. Plus, once I replace the plenum gasket this weekend, I should get a little better mpg. Maybe I'll get to about 13 around town. I just try to stay positive and compare my mpg to the EPA ratings (11/16). I would actually have to try, especially on the highway, to get mileage that bad (I can break 19 averaging 65mph with the A/C blasted). I expect to get about 20 - 22 on my trip to college (350 miles). As long as I get at least 20, I'll be happy, as I'll be able to do it on 1 tank of gas without sucking it dry (23 gallon tank).

After college I plan to buy something more efficient and retire this thing from DD duty. However, for now, I need the cargo capacity, possibly the towing capacity, and the deep snow capability. And on the highway, all the low end torque makes it very pleasant to drive. It's not screaming along (turns about 1800 at 60mph). Plus, once it's in OD with the TC locked, unless I have to drop below 40 (or about 45 on the steepest of hills), it never downshifts.
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Last edited by comptiger5000; 07-29-2010 at 01:46 PM..
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Old 07-29-2010, 03:49 PM   #15 (permalink)
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Tygen1, I was surprised at your Escorts performance when I checked the fuel log a couple of weeks back. Most of the Escorts maxed out at 40 mpg and you had an automatic easily running 45mpg (90 day ave).

How did you get such a low consumptions for GPH. My car (1.9L) is about 0.37 in Drive idling, and 0.30 in Neutral.
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Old 07-29-2010, 05:14 PM   #16 (permalink)
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i have an automated manual, or is that manualised auto? anyways i can average low 40's over a tank if i drive carefully. i dont let me vaccum gauge go below 10 inches of mercury. no a/c, alternator disabled, power steering belt removed. i just dont think eoc has much benefit. that and i can control the torque converter lockup so i could, in theory, engine off coast. but i just dont think it's worth much mpg overall since i live in south florida and it's flat as kansas here.

the 2 main things that helped me was removing the cat, and removing the egr. maybe the cat was clogged, i dont know but it definitly helpd. the egr helped because not having it means the throttle plate is not as far open as it normally would if the egr was working. because the throttle is closed more, the computer gived the engine more ignition timing. for my engine, timing=efficency.

i actually did a-b-a testing by driving around with my scanner hooked up so i can see the ignition timing. pulling the wire on the egr valve cause it to jump up.
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welded straight pipe in place of cat-cons
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Old 07-29-2010, 05:38 PM   #17 (permalink)
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C3H8, it's a manumatic, which is just a normal auto with the ability to shift as you wish. Makes your 40MPG more impressive


(my first post was going to be an introduction, but I really ought to be studying for university, so I'll get round to that when I have more time)
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Old 07-29-2010, 08:59 PM   #18 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sl2eggplant View Post
Tygen1, I was surprised at your Escorts performance when I checked the fuel log a couple of weeks back. Most of the Escorts maxed out at 40 mpg and you had an automatic easily running 45mpg (90 day ave).

How did you get such a low consumptions for GPH. My car (1.9L) is about 0.37 in Drive idling, and 0.30 in Neutral.
Well I spoke too soon, I had a hunch when I filled up today that it was going to be good. 50.15mpg on this normal week of commuting. If I can get the latest mod to not make the PCM go crazy, then I could start to see consistant 50mpg tanks commuting.

I attribute the low idle gph to the HAI. It is in the high twenty's without it and the high teens to low twenties with it. It's real inconsistant though, real touchy. If I let it go to DFC, then kick it into neautral, then it will give the mid teens pretty consistantly, around 0.14-0.17. If I DFC, in gear, and let it run down to real low speeds, that's when I see the crazy low gph numbers. I have pictures to prove it!
In drive I see the same gph as out of gear, maybe 0.01 difference.
I've run some charts using an Idle GPH of 0.21 and looking at the percentage of Coasting I am able to do per day and I could only see a 3% improvement by EOC for my commute...maybe 1 mpg is not that big of deal. I do hope to do a MTX conversion next year.
I've been at this for a little more than a year, I believe anyone can do this with enough research and effort. It's not excedingly difficult be requires extreme patience and persistance.
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Old 07-29-2010, 09:47 PM   #19 (permalink)
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Fudge.

Tygen1, glad to see the HAI is working for you.

I just permanently retired the HAI since it did not help my mpg and probably decreased it. I'm disappointed but happy to be rid of it so I can move on to something better. I got 46 mpg on this tank give or take some error from pumping at a different gas station ... expected 52 based on scanguage .... but I knew that I was running less efficient after burning my first quarter tank of gas since I was 20 miles below my mark for a 3/4 tank.

Well, hopefully I can break 50 mpg using the stock intake system.
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Old 07-29-2010, 10:10 PM   #20 (permalink)
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I wouldn't give up on the HAI so quick, pump errors can really throw things off, just look at my fuel log of SG vs. Pump and will see some wild variations. Use your SG to track your IGN timing or LOD to give you an idea of how these changes effect things. If you PCM is pulling timing with the hot air, then it will hurt mpg. My PCM doesn't care how hot it gets, I just loose power and gain mpg. Either way you are doing great. It took me quite a while to sort things out, there are a multitude of factors that effect mpg.

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