Would a modern car with drum brakes all-around still have a chance?

[j-c-c]

Originally Posted by Vwbeamer

drum brakes are usually lighter than a disc, the caliber and associated brackets needed to mount the caliber. My Tacoma has rear drums.

FWIW, my 2nd Tacoma bought new has 550K+ miles and has the original rear brakes (Drums). Of course, that would be possible in rare circumstances, but I have replaced front rotors at least once and pads more times than I remember, so the brakes are put to use.

Back to OP's original question, the profusion of ABS in the last two decades has leaned/leaning towards disc brakes, mainly because ABS pulses the brake pressure allowing for slight rotation of a locked/locking tire, and a drum system will not respond fast enough to keep up with the ABS modulation.
I'm surprised this point has not been addressed on this thread yet.
So is it doable, yes, is it effective, evidently not ideally.

[cRiPpLe_rOoStEr]

Originally Posted by j-c-c

Back to OP's original question, the profusion of ABS in the last two decades has leaned/leaning towards disc brakes, mainly because ABS pulses the brake pressure allowing for slight rotation of a locked/locking tire, and a drum system will not respond fast enough to keep up with the ABS modulation.

ABS brakes had been mandatory for cars and commercial vehicles since 2014 in my country, and drums are still more common on medium-duty and heavy-duty trucks, and buses. When it comes to motorcycles, drum brakes on them have always been mechanically-actuated, while discs became hydraulic sooner, even though some models from the '70s featured mechanical disc brakes. The only motorcycles I see with ABS are fitted with disc brakes at least upfront.

[freebeard]

FWIW, my 2nd Tacoma bought new has 550K+ miles and has the original rear brakes (Drums). Of course, that would be possible in rare circumstances, but I have replaced front rotors at least once and pads more times than I remember, so the brakes are put to use.

What's the front/rear weight ratio? Back in the mid-century it was the custom to put a sack of rocks or something in the back to keep the back end from coming around on hard braking.

[cRiPpLe_rOoStEr]

Originally Posted by freebeard

Back in the mid-century it was the custom to put a sack of rocks or something in the back to keep the back end from coming around on hard braking.

I remember people doing that in the '90s to improve traction in RWD trucks. When it comes to brakes, before ABS became mainstream, I remember some Brazilian Chevrolet trucks featuring a load-sense proportioning valve (LSPV), which used to be wrongly advertised as if it was an actual ABS on the rear wheels.

[j-c-c]

Originally Posted by cRiPpLe_rOoStEr

ABS brakes had been mandatory for cars and commercial vehicles since 2014 in my country, and drums are still more common on medium-duty and heavy-duty trucks, and buses. When it comes to motorcycles, drum brakes on them have always been mechanically-actuated, while discs became hydraulic sooner, even though some models from the '70s featured mechanical disc brakes. The only motorcycles I see with ABS are fitted with disc brakes at least upfront.

Sorry, I missed your counterpoint, care to re address?

[j-c-c]

Originally Posted by freebeard

What's the front/rear weight ratio? Back in the mid-century it was the custom to put a sack of rocks or something in the back to keep the back end from coming around on hard braking.

Not sure, but it varies to way overload to empty. I'd personally credit the driver as the biggest factor? here, being was taught by his father a mechanic that brakes are mainly for using only when reaching one's destination.

[cRiPpLe_rOoStEr]

Originally Posted by j-c-c

Sorry, I missed your counterpoint, care to re address?

You said drums would not respond fast enough to the ABS modulation, but it's not exactly the case. No wonder it's still widely used in commercial trucks and buses in my country. Sure a more conservative bias among fleet managers here may also lead to a demand for drum brakes, but if drums were really unsuitable for ABS modulation they would've been effectively replaced by discs. Maybe the fact that most trucks and buses resort to air brakes, it may also lead to a better responsiveness to ABS modulation, even with drum brakes all-around.

[JSH]

Originally Posted by cRiPpLe_rOoStEr

You said drums would not respond fast enough to the ABS modulation, but it's not exactly the case. No wonder it's still widely used in commercial trucks and buses in my country. Sure a more conservative bias among fleet managers here may also lead to a demand for drum brakes, but if drums were really unsuitable for ABS modulation they would've been effectively replaced by discs. Maybe the fact that most trucks and buses resort to air brakes, it may also lead to a better responsiveness to ABS modulation, even with drum brakes all-around.

Hydraulic ABS and Stability Control work just fine with drums for passenger cars too. My 2005 and 2009 Prius had rear drums, as does my 2005 Astro Van.

The 2023 VW ID.4 has rear drums as does a 2023 Toyota Tacoma.

[cRiPpLe_rOoStEr]

Originally Posted by JSH

Hydraulic ABS and Stability Control work just fine with drums for passenger cars too.

Of course it works, no wonder I would be quite curious to see new cars with drum brakes all-around.

My 2005 and 2009 Prius had rear drums, as does my 2005 Astro Van.

The 2023 VW ID.4 has rear drums as does a 2023 Toyota Tacoma.

The vast majority of new cars and light commercial vehicles in my country are still fitted with rear drum brakes, Volkswagen even "downgraded" the Polo from all-around discs to have rear drums.

[JSH]

Originally Posted by cRiPpLe_rOoStEr

Of course it works, no wonder I would be quite curious to see new cars with drum brakes all-around.

I was agreeing with you. JCC is wrong when he says drums went away because of ABS.

Drums went away on the front axle to increase braking power and reduce fading. Drums went away on the rear axle in wealthy countries due to marketing.